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+--- Thread: What are \'Parthian shots\'? (/showthread.php?tid=23857)
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Vindex - 05-10-2014
Quote:[attachment=9813]BritishMuseumLondon.jpg[/attachment]
Nice - The jpg description says British Museum - do you know which piece it is part of?
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Alanus - 05-10-2014
Quote:Nay, 'tis the usual way gorytoi were worn in early times. I wouldn't know how its speed compares with a right-hip quiver, but it's not as awkward as it looks.
I think Dan is correct. In this early period, the Parthians and Scythians wore their swords on the right hip, so the gorytos had to be at the rider's left. The arrow could be easily withdrawn when firing to either side. If the rider used a thumb draw, then it would be even handier... especially when firing a Parthian shot.
mile:PS: there's a nice portrayal of a Parthian firing his classic shot on the cover J.P. Mallory's In Search of the Indo-Europeans.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Michael Kerr - 05-10-2014
Alanus wrote:
Quote:PS: there's a nice portrayal of a Parthian firing his classic shot on the cover J.P. Mallory's In Search of the Indo-Europeans.
Had a scan of that book cover so image only below. 8+)
[attachment=9846]Parthianshotsmall.jpg[/attachment]
Regards
Michael Kerr
Michael Kerr
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Vindex - 05-10-2014
Interesting; the reconstruction shows the archer aiming his shot, yet this artefact shows a more "instinctive" shot. From this depiction, I'd want my quiver on the left, too.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Eleatic Guest - 05-10-2014
Quote:Nice - The jpg description says British Museum - do you know which piece it is part of?
Unfortunately not. I got it from Wikipedia years ago. If they have filed it properly, the image must be stored in at least one of those three categories:
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Parthia
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Sassanids
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:British_Museum
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Michael Kerr - 05-10-2014
Vindex wrote:
Quote:Nice - The jpg description says British Museum - do you know which piece it is part of?Hi, found some information on that piece from CAIS 'The Circle of Ancient Iranian Studies'. Caption says.
A charming Amazon warrior woman delivering a' Parthian shot'. A figure from the lid of a bronze dinos or cauldron of Etruscan origin excavated at Santa Maria di Capua Vetere, sixth century B.C.E. I have some other greyscale shots of the same figure but low res originals so fine details of Stefan's original one are lost.
[attachment=9848]Amazon_Parthian_Shot.jpg[/attachment]
[attachment=9849]Parthianarcher.jpg[/attachment]
Nathan Ross wrote:
Quote:Ovid and Virgil and others, who caught on very quickly to the metaphorical application. They, like Proust in the quote above, seem to attribute this tactic to women.You might be right as the rider on the cauldron lid is an Amazon warrior and the rider on the cover shot from "In Search of the Indo-Europeans" also seems to be an Amazon or at least feminine so it might have originally been attributed more to women or Amazons in their artwork predating Rome's encounters with the Parthians as I am sure steppe horsemen or horsewomen had been taught this tactic since they got onto the back of a horse.
Regards
Michael Kerr
Michael Kerr
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Alanus - 05-10-2014
Very interesting points, as both depictions do seem to portray Amazons... who certainly knew their bow and sagaris. Both are continually shown in art (especially Greek vases) used by steppe women. On another thread we discussed the Sagaraskya culture, and a significant number of their women were buried with archery equipment. The rider on the Etruscan caldron cover also gives the appearance of an instinctive shooter, and she is shown in a position after the release of her arrow. [Although we always think of the Etruscans in Italy, at one time they lived in the Lavant.]
mile:
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Vindex - 05-10-2014
Re the instinctive shot - I'd agree the first depiction shows that too; but from the angle of the first picture I was unsure whether the archer was drawing an arrow from the quiver or loosing so didn't include it initially.
Having said that, where her hand is after the release, her quiver is also in the right place!
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Alanus - 05-10-2014
Ah, yes. I didn't notice that. A minimum of hand movement and time expended. We forget that steppe archers were not much different than "machine-gunners." If you had a couple hundred archers snapping-off Parthian shots, the sky would be almost as black as Leonidas'. Lajos Kassi can fire 12 arrows in 15 seconds and continuously hit thrown targets similar to frizbees. :woot:
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Eleatic Guest - 05-10-2014
Didn't Sima Qian record a story where three mounted Xiong Nu falcon hunterers picked off a Han Chinese platoon from horseback by circling and firing?
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Flavivs Aetivs - 05-10-2014
Cantabrian Circle?
Also, I have a few images from On the World of the Huns of guys shooting backwards I think. I'll try and post them.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - daryush - 05-11-2014
This quiver layout from the painting and the Greek art is too early for Arsacid era, and the layout is western Scythian anyhow, not eastern / Central Asian which was a little different. I have a feeling many of the depictions of "backwards" gorytoi are either held that way at leisure and not in battle, or depictions of the gorytoi horizontally across the back at the level of the lumbar spine, like with Plains Indians quivers, which actually gives a really nice and easy draw.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Alanus - 05-11-2014
Nadeem,
I think one of the above illustrations shows an Amazon using the over-the-right-shoulder method you just mentioned. That's how I carry my quiver and it works very well.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - Dan D'Silva - 05-11-2014
Quote:This quiver layout from the painting and the Greek art is too early for Arsacid era...Yeah. I should've said "in the Achaemenid period" instead of "in early times." It's just I don't know exactly when the more westerly archers started changing things.
What are \'Parthian shots\'? - daryush - 05-11-2014
Alanus, I meant more like this: http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7e/5a/cd/7e5acdf9c5bfe3ec8f3d590eab16cb05.jpg
The quiver is horizontally across the lower back rather than on the left or right of the archer, and it's a waist draw, not a shoulder draw.