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Damascus Steel - Redwald - 09-30-2012
Simon James's book -- "Rome and the Sword" is an excellent commentary on the development of the Roman sword (and of Rome). He describes manufacturing techniques and shows that Romans did use pattern welded swords themselves. I have the "Sword and the Crucible", too, but have found it a little disappointing (especially as it is so expensive).
Vagn Fabritius Buchwald's "Iron and Steel in Ancient Times", in my opinion, is a far better book and provides a more lucid explanation of the process, including some tests on original swords from the Illerup bog.
But you are right Alanus, there aren't enough books on swords......
Paul
Damascus Steel - Alanus - 09-30-2012
Thanks for the tip, Paul
I found Buchwald's book online for a decent price. And I noticed the chapter on pattern-steel is dated AD 0-600, then a later chapter on Scandinavian steel. Here again, are we looking at pattern-welded steel as "late" in the West, aka post-Pliny, as compared to Central Asia and the East?
Damascus Steel - Redwald - 09-30-2012
Alan, I hope that you like the book. I think that it is an excellent resource.
Most authorities, including Williams, James and Buchwald, suggest that pattern welding techniques were first used and developed by the Celts, and then taken up by others. Manufacture of pattern welded swords, probably under the control of the Romans, would appear to be well underway by the 2nd century; at least that appears to be when the Germanic tribes start taking to the double edged 'spatha' in preference to their single edged swords.
I am not aware of pattern welded swords being made earlier in the East but it would be interesting to see an example if they are around. Pattern welding, is of course just a development of hammer welding two or more components together. Folding iron or steel can take place without the process of pattern welding.
Incidentally, both Williams and Buchwald are able to demonstrate that pattern welding didn't necessarily produce a better blade than other methods, but they go being used in the north for a long time, and it is probable that it was the patterns that had some significance for those peoples.
Here is a review of Buchwald's book: http://www.erudit.org/revue/etudinuit/2003/v27/n1-2/010816ar.pdf
Paul
Damascus Steel - Robert - 09-30-2012
The pattern can only be made visible by etching two different kinds of iron/steel used to make the blade, or you would need two irons of different colour. Now I have seen a lot of iron, but when polished smooth, there is little difference to be seen.
Damascus Steel - XorX - 12-01-2012
That is not completely true...
My personal experience while making patterned Blades is that some combinations (wrought iron with a content of phosphorum and steel with ca. 0,6-0,8% of carbon for example) begin to show the pattern when ground on a band-grinder with P 80-P120!
Effects of the heat-treating also become visible in the grinding process (darker colour of the hardened edge of a mono-C 60 blade when hand-ground at P 240 for example)
There IS little difference visible between the two materials, that`s for sure, but there are sources for the migration period (Theoderich`s famous letter) that tell us that the blades were polished "like mirrors" and the pattern visible when "playing with light effects" on the blade.
An etching of any kind cannot produce this effect because of the relief which is caused by the different reaction of the materials.
A very good work about the polishing and forging techniques from the late antique onwards is: "Stähle, Steine und Schlangen; zur Technikgeschichte von Schwertklingen des frühen Mittelalters" by Stefan Mäder, Schriftenreihe des kantonalen Museums Altes Zeughaus Solothurn Heft 24 2009
Damascus Steel - Robert - 12-01-2012
@ Jurgen So there must have been another way of showing off the pattern welding to its full effect. I like your work, by the way!!
Damascus Steel - XorX - 12-02-2012
Thank you Robert :-) , I`d like to return the compliment!
The "other way" must have been som sort of polishing with different stones and powders / pastes equal to the japanese techniques of sword polishing. Every fine-grinding process with pliant devices will cause a sort of "wavy" microrelief between areas of different hardness in a steel. Also steels with differences in their alloys will react different to the same grinding / polishing medium causing a visible effect.
The "Neuburger Kreide" for example, a special natural silica from a small area north the danube in Neuburg / Bavaria, which now is used in "Sonax" car-polishing stuff, is said to have been mined in roman times.
I´m in some experiments on the effect that different natural european stones and mineral powders produce in the finish of blades of welded steel / iron construction.
But there is still very much work...
Damascus Steel - MDF - 12-03-2012
Yes I confirm,
in my experience I did some pattern welded blades and if you reflect the light you can see a bit the different, of course, much depends on the type of steel. I noticed that when the sanding belts are new, the contrast is greater. with a P100 is already possible to see also an differential hardening.
Jurgen, a question about the abrasives, you know if the Romans used Aquisetum for polishing metals? is a plant rich in silicon which can be used to polish. If I remember correctly the Romans used this plant in medicine so maybe they knew other uses of this...but I do not know. You know it?
Damascus Steel - XorX - 12-03-2012
I only know about the use of this plant for finishing wooden surfaces in later times (13th ct. onwards, I think...) If I remember correctly, Theophylus Presbyter mentioned that in his book about different crafts at ca. 1200 a.d.
Modern woodworkers told me it creates a surface equal to P300 - 400 depending on the wood and the duration of the grinding and the wear of the plant.
I`ve never used it to polish steel but it might be an interesting experiment.
It`s a shame that there wasn`t written more about that "subordinate" craft im former times.
Damascus Steel - Kai - 12-03-2012
Nice to see you on RAT, Jürgen!
Quote:I´m in some experiments on the effect that different natural european stones and mineral powders produce in the finish of blades of welded steel / iron construction.
But there is still very much work...
I am looking forward to see the results!
Indeed, in his letter to the Varni-King Theoderic mentions the splendidissimus pulvis, the most shiny/most famous powder/dust used to polish the swords to great effect, which was a natural resource of the Varni-country.
Unfortunately, it is unknown who the Varni were... Vandals and Thuringians are possible. (The 'schwarze Stämme' which can be found in a German translation hinting to the Vandal-Kingdom is a very... imaginative idea. To be sure, there are many imaginative ideas about what that means.)
This is the full text:
REGI VVARNORUM THEODERICUS REX.
[1] Cum piceis timbribus et pueros gentili candore relucentes, spathas nobis etiam arma desecantes vestra fraternitas destinavit, ferro magis quam auri pretio ditiores. splendet illic claritas expolita ut intuentium facies fideli puritate restituant, quarum margines in acutum tali aequalitate descendunt, ut non limis compositae, sed igneis fornacibus credantur effusae. harum media pulchris alveis excavata quibusdam videntur crispari posse vermiculis: ubi tanta varietatis umbra conludit, ut intextum magis credas variis coloribus lucidum metallum. [2] Hoc vestra cotis diligenter emundat, hoc vester splendidissimus pulvis ita industriose detergit, ut speculum quoddam virorum faciat ferream lucem, qui ideo patriae vestrae natura largiente concessus est, ut huius rei opinionem vobis faceret singularem: enses, qui pulchritudine sui putentur esse Vulcani, qui tanta elegantia fabrilia visus est excolere, ut quod eius manibus formabatur, non opus mortalium, sed crederetur esse divinum. [3] Proinde per illum et illum legatos vestros solventes debitae salutationis affectum arma vestra libenter nos accepisse declaramus, quae bonae pacis studia transmiserunt: vicissitudinem muneris pro expensarum vestrarum consideratione tribuentes, quae tantum vobis reddantur accepta, quantum nobis vestra fuere gratissima. praestent divina concordiam, ut haec inter nos grata mente facientes gentium nostrarum velle iungamus et invicem solliciti mutuis possimus utilitatibus obligari.
Damascus Steel - Boudicca Iceni - 12-04-2012
There are sertain some pattern welded pugiones, but personally I never saw a pattern welded gladius. Does anyone have a reference to an archaeological piece?
Damascus Steel - Alanus - 01-12-2013
Back to Kai,
Splendidissimus pulvis could have been "diatomacius earth." That's what the white powder the Chinese are presently using looks like. I used diatomacius earth as an ingredient in pottery slip years ago. It's not particularly heathy stuff and can cause cancer if you breathe too much of it. I have some folded steel Chinese blades that are so polished they no longer show the pattern. You can only make it out by using a flash light in the dark.
Damascus Steel - Robert - 04-01-2013
http://scripties.let.eldoc.ub.rug.nl/FILES/root/Master/DoorstroomMasters/Archeologie/2010/S.B.M.Pelsmaeker/Ma-1619896-S.B.M._Pelsmaeker.pdf
For all those interested in pattern welded blades, here is a VERY good thesis by a archeology student who has delved into the history and praticalities of pattern welded swords combined with some serious forging of two swords. Both were then tested to destruction. It offers some very nice insights and he seems to have certainly done his research on all available relevant resources.
A note to those wanting to repeat the experiments, reviewing the article, I also think I spotted the cause for the only partial hardening of the swords. The cause can IMHO be found in the one-sided positioning of the bellows, causing the fire to burn unevenly hot.
Damascus Steel - Gaius Julius Caesar - 04-01-2013
I was speaking to a weapons smith about this last week, and while his work is predominantly Viking and Saxon pattern welled swords and seaxs, he also works in damacene. Or more accurately, wootze steel blades, perhaps. I hope he will be looking more into Roman pattern welding as well.
Damascus Steel - XorX - 04-02-2013
Robert: The link doesn`t work for me :-(
Byron: It`s good that you specified "damascus steel" as wootz here! There is very much confusion about the use of the term "damascus steel" or "damascene" in modern publications. Nearly no historian or archeologist is able to determine the differences between welded steels (pattern welded or welded blade constructions where the pattern is secondary)and the family of the asian crucible steels