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+--- Thread: Let\'s talk about the FURCA again (/showthread.php?tid=22808)
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Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-21-2013
Furca , Palus, or Crux?
Or, in English, Fork, Pole or Cross?
We know that Roman soldiers on the march carried their gear on something called a furca. The commonest reenactor decision is a cross stick or a T pole, but if that is the case, why do you think this piece of lumber was called a furca by the ancient writers?
To my little brain, a forked stick is the Occam's Razor answer to the question.
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - agrimensor - 06-21-2013
I just went into a bush and cut a forked stick and ready was my furca and it works perfect
[attachment=7436]furca.jpg[/attachment]
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-21-2013
I have two of them on my front porch. They do seem to fit the bill, don't they?
What sort of wood is that, Jos?
Mine are Chinaberry (Melia azedarach) because that tree makes many forks, and the branches tend to be straight, and they need to be cut anyway. http://www.texasinvasives.org/resources/publications/11_Chinaberry_TFA.pdf
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - Mark Hygate - 06-21-2013
Quote:I just went into a bush and cut a forked stick and ready was my furca and it works perfect
Possibly the best answer on this forum I've seen so far!
Trees grow with natural forks just as the above - an incredibly useful thing to have, with as much 'stuff' looped over it as you can carry. If it breaks (it has natural strength), cut another.
Me - I too would go for a, very natural, 'fork' - why try and 'improve' (which I doubt) on nature?
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - agrimensor - 06-21-2013
amother idea, when clearing the terrain for a camp, a lot of wood is displaced. Some wood be used as firewood but the rest can be used for something else. If i go for a walk or
run my eye sees a lot od undergrowet that can de used, as furca. or as tentpole ( some ar more then 4m in lenght and about 5 cm in diameter) or when pointed would be perfect as a pilum muralis. In my opimion those found ( pilum muralis) are the ones used as a kind of hedghog in front of the gates .
It is al highly speculative what my thoughts are so shoot !!!! BTW if they weren't usable anymore it could give some warmth anyway on a chilly or cold night.
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-25-2013
The bags and gear shown on Trajan's Column don't really tell much about the stick. It's hard to tell about the way the gear is attached, to my eye anyway, on those gear poles. Clearly, they didn't carry their gear way up in the air over their heads. Nobody can do that with a load for long. Could these be forked sticks, too?
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - Titus Manlius Verus - 06-26-2013
It's hard to tell. However, The furcas on the far left do not look like they are on the classic "T" pole design. This could be an artistic error, though. However, everyone knows Roman artists never made mistakes... :wink:
[attachment=7469]TClegion.jpg[/attachment]
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-26-2013
MISTAKES?? ROMAN artists??
No, certainly not!!
:whistle: :grin:
It always gives me a strange sense of amusement when people argue venomously over things we simply don't know. But it still seems strange that Romans would call something a "furca" if it didn't have a fork in it. Maybe someone with good Latin skills could help us out with that.
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - P Sertorius Scaevola - 06-26-2013
The obvious answers are provided above, I would say bringeth forth any evidence for the contrary...
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-28-2013
If I read your answer correctly, then why do almost all reenactors use the crossed stick method?
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - Mark Hygate - 06-28-2013
Quote:If I read your answer correctly, then why do almost all reenactors use the crossed stick method?
I'm going to suggest that it's because straight bits of wood are readily available from stores and this also allows them all to look the same. There's much less natural wooded areas around these days and thus getting the (most likely) proper article is more difficult - although as was shown, not impossible - just takes a bit of time and effort.
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-28-2013
Oh, good! For a minute there, I thought maybe we'd hit on another reenactorism! 8-) :woot:
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - 66kbm - 06-28-2013
Its been put on here before but once more for those that have not read it.....
http://www.legiiavg.org.uk/index_files/Page32663.htm
Try marching with a cross stick, it wobbles from side to side, with 15/18 kg on it.
If all kit is assembled and the heaviest item placed on last then to remove items simply place pole facing at a downward angle and pull the pole sharply back to ones self. The lot comes off instantly....ready to use the pole on the tent...that's a different thread though.
Be open minded and try experimenting with 1 pole with a slight fork on top. You may be surprised.
One thing is when all is attached to the pole tie it all in tight with a long leather thong. Dangling bits are not comfy bits....
Soldiers of all eras go for what works for them.
Kevin
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - M. Demetrius - 06-28-2013
Quote:Soldiers of all eras go for what works for themYes, but that varies with culture, of course. We would not think an animal skin water bag "works for us", as we'd prefer some sort of plastic container that doesn't impart any flavor to the beverage. There are people who don't mind, though, even to this day.
Our systems are not as bacteria resistant as those of the Ancients, it seems. Many of us city dwellers wouldn't last long in the wild, using less sanitary methods than we're used to.
Let\'s talk about the FURCA again - Jori - 06-28-2013
Having marched with a furca in T shape about... 140 kms, I can tell you : it's well balanced, comfortable, and the gear is simple to attach to it. The T shape adjusts to the scutum, and I don't need my hands to carry the furca.
But the main thing is : to carry the pilum with the furca, it's best that the furca is as straight as the pilum. Otherwise, it's hell.