+- RomanArmyTalk (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat)
+-- Forum: Research Arena (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/forumdisplay.php?fid=4)
+--- Forum: Roman Military History & Archaeology (https://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/forumdisplay.php?fid=8)
+--- Thread: Translation of Rome (/showthread.php?tid=5578)
Pages:
1
2
Translation of Rome - Quassnoi - 05-04-2006
Hello all!
I'm trying now to translate HBO:Rome into Russian, have a couple of questions:
1) What was the formal addressing to the officer in Roman Army?
Pullo calls Vorenus 'sir', but it cannot be adequately translated into Russian since Russian soldiers call their officer 'comrades' and literal translation will sound ugly, so I decided to put Latin addressing instead.
2) Is it correct to call Vorenus 'princeps secundus' or 'second cohort centurion'?
Vorenus is called 'second spear centurion', but it sounds ugly in Russian if translated literally.
Thanks in advance, will ask more
Re: Translation of Rome - FAVENTIANVS - 05-04-2006
I think the term should be Domine.
translation - Caius Fabius - 05-04-2006
sir?
your excellency?
maybe
Ваше превосходительство
Re: Translation of Rome - FlaviusCrispus - 05-05-2006
The term most often used to address a superior officer in the Vindolanda tablets is, as Faventius says, "domine," or "my lord." One fellow actually uses "regi," "my king," but that is considered quite unusual. One centurion, addressing his cohort commander, uses "my lord and brother" (domine et fratre).
"Yes, sir!" might be rendered as, "eta, domine!" or more literally "it will be done, my lord!"
Soldiers of equal rank call each other "frater" (brother) or "contuburnali" (translated as "messmate.") Flavius Cerialis' wife addresses her friend as "soror" (sister) among other endearments.
Vorenus is called "first spear centurion," but I think this is a misreading of "primus pilus," which means "first ranker," or "first in his file," not "first spear." The writers are probably thinking the "pilus" refers to a pilum, or javelin, a common misconception.
Is he supposed to be from the second cohort? I can't recall— if that's true, he couldn't be a Primus Pilus, because that rank is the first centurion of the first cohort, to top enlisted man in the legion.
Re: Translation of Rome - Caballo - 05-05-2006
"One fellow actually uses "regi," "my king," but that is considered quite unusual."You are absolutely right to be wary of this usage and (personally) I would definitely avoid this as a salutation- it reflects more the auxiliary troops at Vindolanda and (probably) the use of auxiliary nobles as officers (e.g. Batavian nobles commeanding various Batavian cohorts).
Cheers
Caballo
Re: Translation of Rome - Quassnoi - 05-05-2006
Quote:The term most often used to address a superior officer in the Vindolanda tablets is, as Faventius says, "domine," or "my lord." One fellow actually uses "regi," "my king," but that is considered quite unusual. One centurion, addressing his cohort commander, uses "my lord and brother" (domine et fratre).
Ok, thanks.
Quote:Vorenus is called "first spear centurion," but I think this is a misreading of "primus pilus," which means "first ranker," or "first in his file," not "first spear." The writers are probably thinking the "pilus" refers to a pilum, or javelin, a common misconception.
Is he supposed to be from the second cohort? I can't recall— if that's true, he couldn't be a Primus Pilus, because that rank is the first centurion of the first cohort, to top enlisted man in the legion.
He is called "second spear centurion" when he comes to release Pullo from the jail in the first episode, and "first spear centurion" later:
"You are to be released to the command of second spear centurion Lucius Vorenus"
Perhaps, he might have been promoted after returning Caesar's eagle.
But by that time he was just a "second spear centurion" whatever it means. I think it's actually centurion of the second cohort, or princeps secundus.
Re: Translation of Rome - Tarbicus - 05-05-2006
Does it make any sense to use modern rank equivalents?
Re: Translation of Rome - Quassnoi - 05-05-2006
Quote:Does it make any sense to use modern rank equivalents?
Of course no, it's the Roman Army
When watching a historical movie, one expects centurions, tribunes and primipili.
Re: Translation of Rome - Tarbicus - 05-05-2006
Sorry, I mustn't be very savvy when it comes to film. :?
Re: Translation of Rome - Arngrim - 05-05-2006
I wish the swedish translator of Rome had had the same sense of Quassnoi and ask for information here. Or at least some knowledge of roman history. That Vercingetorix were defeated in the battle of Elyseum was news to me.
THE translation - Goffredo - 05-05-2006
Wouldn't it be challanging to translate the series into LATIN?
Re: Translation of Rome - FlaviusCrispus - 05-05-2006
Quote:He is called "second spear centurion" when he comes to release Pullo from the jail in the first episode, and "first spear centurion" later:
"You are to be released to the command of second spear centurion Lucius Vorenus"
Perhaps, he might have been promoted after returning Caesar's eagle.
OK, good— I was thinking of later in the series, when that nasty mob boss calls him a "first spear centurion" while he's buttering Vorenus up to become one of his strong-arm men. Anyway, he certainly earned a promotion for finding that eagle!
(It's interesting how Pullo keeps getting awarded huge rewards and bonuses, but always manages to be flat broke by the start of the next episode!)
"Princeps secundus" would work fine, I suppose, or "princeps cohors secundus." "Pilus prior, cohors secundus" is probably too long to match the diologue; how does "first ranker, second cohort" translate into Russian?
Re: Translation of Rome - Quassnoi - 05-05-2006
Quote:(It's interesting how Pullo keeps getting awarded huge rewards and bonuses, but always manages to be flat broke by the start of the next episode!)
Sure. It's also interesting how old was he. C.B.G gives no answer, but it's very important for translation too.
I think he was around 23-24 or so.
Quote:"Princeps secundus" would work fine, I suppose, or "princeps cohors secundus." "Pilus prior, cohors secundus" is probably too long to match the diologue; how does "first ranker, second cohort" translate into Russian?
"Принцепс второй когорты" (princeps cohors secundus) will sound best
Re: Translation of Rome - Quassnoi - 05-05-2006
Another question:
When flogging Pullo, Vorenus says: "Justice knows every man's number".
What is it about?
Some Latin idiom or what?
Re: Translation of Rome - Ildar - 05-05-2006
Quote:He is called "second spear centurion" when he comes to release Pullo from the jail in the first episode, and "first spear centurion" later:
Guys, sorry for Russian,
Видимо, в фильм в данном случае перенесены реалии эпохи раннего принципата. И, скорее всего, речь идет о центурионах со 2-ой по 10-ую когорт. Центурионы 1-х двух центурий (1-ый манипул) этих когорт назывались "pilus prior" и "pilus posterior", т.е. "пил 1-ый" и "пил 2-ой". Самый старший центурион легиона называется по-русски "примипил". А обращаться, видимо, нужно "господин".
P.S. Вообще-то Вам лучше сюда: http://forum.xlegio.ru :wink:
P.P.S. Только, пожалуйста, не надо никаких "Пулло" и "Воренусов". Это так раздражает!
