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+--- Thread: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries (/showthread.php?tid=7577)
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Peroni - 02-12-2008
Possibly not, but the armour found in the deposit could well be spoila or something collected on his travels rather than be his own armour!
I'll email you my article on the segmented armour finds of the Batavian Rural areas. :wink:
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - sulla felix - 02-12-2008
Thanks Ade!
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - COLOT Jean Charles - 02-13-2008
Go to this links to see arlon's pictures and a attemp to build a mix segmentata /chain-mail
http://www.leg8.org/viewtopic.php?t=1689
http://www.leg8.com/2008/bavay_fevrier.php
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Gaius Julius Caesar - 02-13-2008
So, are there any XLarge Batavians in need of a Corbridge A?
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Robert - 02-13-2008
The concept that comes to mind is that troops adapted their gear to fit personal taste and preference, something even now seen in armies not dictated by peacetime rules, regulations and spit&polish bureaucrats. If it works beter than what you were handed, USE IT. Anything to promote survivability. Although on general some things are rule (and I will go for the general distinction between Leg and Aux in the way of seg and hamata, if only for economics), there will always be the exception. Do not forget the Gauls were wearing their own version of hamata's when Ceasar trotted along.
When trying to beat the teenage son at Call of Duty, the first thing to discard as an English private battling German troops is the sten and the bolt operated rifle, picking up a MP40 and a autoreloading Gewehr quickly. Greater firepower and more ammo as you advance further away from your supplies and closer to theirs :twisted:
When so many miles away from Rome, make do and live.
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Dan Howard - 02-13-2008
Quote:and I will go for the general distinction between Leg and Aux in the way of seg and hamata, if only for economicsI would love any evidence that indicates the approximate manufacture cost of both a hamata and a segmentata. Are you suggesting that hamata was cheaper or segmentata for Romans to produce?
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Caballo - 02-13-2008
So, are there any XLarge Batavians in need of a Corbridge A?
Send me a PM?
Cheers
Caballo
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Robert - 02-13-2008
It's probably not so much the production cost itself as the need for larger pieces of beter quality iron to produce a decent plate as opposed to making a hamata from smaller lengths of lesser quality stock. It's the economics of production as opposed to the economics of construction, in my view.
There may also be other factors, such as not wishing to supply possibly fickle and potentialy turncoat aux troops with the best gear, this on the assumption the seg is superior to the hamata for the Roman way of fighting.
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Aurelianus - 02-13-2008
Quote:Robert:31xug1m0 Wrote:and I will go for the general distinction between Leg and Aux in the way of seg and hamata, if only for economicsI would love any evidence that indicates the approximate manufacture cost of both a hamata and a segmentata. Are you suggesting that hamata was cheaper or segmentata for Romans to produce?
of topic I think!
Not again ......
This has already been discussed several times :wink:
.
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Dan Howard - 02-13-2008
Quote:It's probably not so much the production cost itself as the need for larger pieces of beter quality iron to produce a decent plate as opposed to making a hamata from smaller lengths of lesser quality stock.The problem with this is that it takes higher quality wrought iron to make mail than it does to make plate. If there are too many (or too large) slag inclusions, the metal cannot be drawn into wire. Plate can be manufactured from poorer quality iron. IMO mail cost far more to produce than segmentata which is why you only see low ranking soldiers wearing segmentata.
Is there any real evidence to suggest that auxiliaries were equipped in inferior gear compared to low ranking legionaries? I was under the impression that auxilliaries supplied their own gear while the legions were equipped by the state (even though they paid for the gear themselves).
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Gaius Julius Caesar - 02-13-2008
Caballo, PM sent!
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Magnus - 02-14-2008
I wonder too if some of the auxilliaries didn't swap pieces of gear with Legionaries, or just outright bought some Legionary gear.
Re: Lorica Segmentata and auxiliaries - Matthew Amt - 02-14-2008
Quote:Is there any real evidence to suggest that auxiliaries were equipped in inferior gear compared to low ranking legionaries? I was under the impression that auxilliaries supplied their own gear while the legions were equipped by the state (even though they paid for the gear themselves).
Strictly speaking, even the legionaries were technically responsible for their own gear. We don't know the ins and outs of how stuff was "issued" or acquired, until the third century when it's really state-issued. What's interesting is that we keep talking about how auxiliaries supplied themselves or used "native" equipment, but in their gravestones they practically look more uniform than the legionaries! Certainly they have very spiffy belts, so I would hesitate to assume they got second-rate or obsolete stuff. I also like the letter from the Egyptian kid who has joined the fleet and asks his father to send him a good spear and a pickaxe--what the heck?
Questioning the answers, again....
Matthew