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+--- Thread: Scalping (/showthread.php?tid=9915)
Scalping - Wes - 07-16-2007
Greetings!
I wa reading Hollands "Rubicon" and he mentions scalpings, does anyone have anymore info on this?? I am especially curious, as I also re-enact the 7 years war, and 18th century stuff. Thanks!!
Respectfully,
Wes
Re: Scalping - Marcus Hortensius Castus - 07-16-2007
I DO know in 8th grade I read "Crucible of War." If you're interested in the 7 years war, and you've not read that book... DO IT! The author also wrote an abridged version that's more suitable for bedtime reading; the full one is about 800 pages and it took me from 7th grade to 9th grade to read it and understand it all. I need to re-read it now all these years later.
however, I know that scalping was originated in Europe and the colonial powers used it to have their native allies tally their kills so they could be payed.
However, that's all I know on the subject and your interest in the 7 years war peaked my interest in turn.
Re: Scalping - Ross Cowan - 07-16-2007
Romans apparently scalped the women defending the German wagon laager at Vercellae in 101 BC. Silius Italicus (?) also suggests that the helmet of Flaminius was decorated with the skin, possibly the scalp of a Gallic chief. See For the Glory of Rome for refs and discussion.
For scalping in the imperial period, see G. D. Stiebel, "Scalping in Roman Palestine - 'minime Romanum sacrum'?" Scripta Classica Israelica 24 (2005), 151-162
R
Re: Scalping - Gaius Julius Caesar - 07-16-2007
Hmmmm, maybe those hair-covered batavian face mask helms arnt so innocent after all!
shock:
Re: Scalping - Wes - 07-16-2007
I knew scalping was European, but I had no clue it went so far back! I was happily reading away at Roman History and BAM...scalping pops out. Makes me remember the days I spent running the woods in a breechclout....boy was my wife amused!!!! lol
Thanks!
Wes
Re: Scalping - Ironhand - 07-16-2007
Very interesting, but not surprising. I wouldn't make the mistake of just assuming that it was foreign auxiliaries. Romans considered themselves "civilized", but the criteria was often pretty strange and brutally wasn't just the trait of "barbarians". I think the Romans would rank up there with most Western cultures when it comes to acts like that.
Re: Scalping - Praefectusclassis - 07-17-2007
Quote:maybe those hair-covered batavian face mask helms arnt so innocent after allWell, it's horse hair, so... :wink:
Re: Scalping - Conal - 07-17-2007
Quote:Quote:maybe those hair-covered batavian face mask helms arnt so innocent after allWell, it's horse hair, so... :wink:
Th eromans scalped horses .... the eeeeevil baaa
hock:
Re: Scalping - john m roberts - 07-17-2007
That stuff about Europeans teaching Indians to scalp is nonsense. It was invented in the 60s when people wanted to believe that pre-Columbian Indians were prelapsarian innocents, wandering about sylvan glades, thinking ecological thoughts and expressing them in noble-sounding New Age poetry until corrupted by evil old Europeans. Problem is, pre-Columbian Indians weren't 20th Century middle-class white folks. All the earliest European explorers noted the Indian propensity for collecting hair. It's been done for thousands of years on every continent.
As an example, I found this in the foreword to Cormac McCarthy's "Blood Meridian" (a great read, by the way, all about a scalp-hunting expedition in Mexico in 1849).
From the Yuma Daily Sun, June 13, 1982:
"Clark, who led last year's expedition to the Afar region of northern Ethiopia, and UC Berkeley colleague Tim D. White, also said that a re-examination of a 300,000 year-old-fossil skull found in the same region earlier shows evidence of having been scalped."
That's not a typo. Three hundred thousand years ago some poor bastard got scalped.
Re: Scalping - hoplite14gr - 07-17-2007
John I agree with you about scalping in N. America and thanks for the "Ethiopian link" info. So far the trend was that scalping was of step origin according to Herodotus. (Skythias and other Nomads)
Some say that the turkic horse hair banners were "scalp-banners" initially.
Seems gruesome trophy collection is a "cross-caltural" thing.
Kind regards
Re: Scalping - Gaius Julius Caesar - 07-17-2007
Well, its hardly a big step from headhunting, and we all know the most civilized of empires had a habit of doing it too! I won't bother pointing fingers, because there are actually several candidates for that prize, now that I think of it! :?