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What did the Byzantines invent?
#10
Just to give an idea where I am from: I am heavily leaning towards the perception that ancient Chinese technological achievements, in the wake of Needham's ground-breaking but biased work, are often greatly exaggerated. That is not say though that the Chinese did not make very important contributions but all too often development ceased at an early point before the full potential was exploited.

Quote:Several of the inventions listed I know nothing about, but the trebuchet, surely, is clearly attested in Mozi - C4th BC or thereabouts.

The trebuchet is a bit a case in point. There is no doubt that the manned trebuchet, that is with pulling crews, originated in China and was most likely diffused via the steppe people (Avars?) first to the Byzantines, then to the expanding realm of Islam and medieval Europe. BUT the really powerful artillery which could tear down walls, that is the hybrid trebuchet (powered by a combination of pullers and a counterweight) and above all the counterweight trebuchet were both invented far from China, in the Eastern Mediterranean between 700 and 1150 AD.

Interestingly, a renowned Muslim historian (Rashid al-Din) reports that the mightiest counterweight trebuchet, a Frankish design, was imported by Muslim engineers in Mongolian service to China where the design was unknown and was instrumental in the main sieges which sealed the fate of the Song dynasty in 1273:

Quote:Before that there had not been any large Frankish catapult in Cathay [i.e. China], but Talib, a catapult-maker from this land, had gone to Baalbek and Damascus, and his sons Abubakr, Ibrahim, and Muhammad, and his employees made seven large catapults and set out to conquer the city [Sayan Fu or Hsiang-yang fu = modern Xiangfan].

See: Chevedden, Paul E. (2000). "The Invention of the Counterweight Trebuchet:A Study in Cultural Diffusion (TEXT)". Dumbarton Oaks Papers, No. 54. pp. 72–116.

Quote:Surviving Chinese handguns from Manchuria are datable to the late 13th century - that's earlier than any convincing evidence from elsewhere. Gunpowder bombs shot from trebuchets are clearly described in the 12th century.

This particular 'evidence' has always bugged me because the find was dated by Joseph Needham on the superficial similarity with roughly contemporary European handguns to that date. But Needham, a trained chemist, was neither an archaeologist nor a sinologist. By modern scientific standards his dating was a joke just as his interpretation of an 11th century Buddhist cave carving of a wind bellows as a handgun. IMO his desire to inflate Chinese achievements and create 'firsts' was all too transparent and greatly detracts from his work which remains the basis of many sinocentric claims to this day.
Stefan (Literary references to the discussed topics are always appreciated.)
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Messages In This Thread
Re: What did the Byzantines invent? - by Kineas - 10-30-2009, 04:06 AM
Re: What did the Byzantines invent? - by Eleatic Guest - 11-02-2009, 11:41 AM

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