Employing war elephants

[D B Campbell]

what graffito?

The one that started this thread, Phil!

[Sardaukar]

One interesting thought is that (at least expressed by Delbrück (Delbruck) in his Warfare in Antiquity: History of the Art of War, Volume I) Hannibal, when faced by superior enemy cavalry in Zama (was about first time he had to face that situation), employed 2 tactics to negate it.

First, he employed war elephants for protection against cavalry.

I'm pretty certain that Hannibal at Zama deployed his elephants in front of his infantry and not the cavalry.

This is why Scipio unusually deployed the maniples directly behind each other rather than in the usual quincunx formation.

True that. But effect was still there, be it an attempt to break enemy infantry or protect them from cavalry. In my humble opinion, there has rarely been battle in antiquity where two military geniuses battle..and both did quite well.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

what graffito?

The one that started this thread, Phil!

But furry boots can one find a visual depiction of this graffiti? In the source quoted in the first post?

[Theodosius the Great]

Here's a rather late episode :

According to Dio [74.16] he mentions that Didius Julianus tried to make use of the circus elephants to oppose Septimius Severus. But "the elephants found the towers oppressive and so would not even carry their drivers any longer [but threw them off also]. "

The big animals were only useful if the commander knew how to use them, and generals appear to have been extremely inapt in the use of elephants.

The HA depicts Julianus as a man with some military ability when it came to repelling barbarians from his provinces as a Praetor.

Granted : it had been hundreds of years since the Romans last used elephants. And, yes, these were circus-trained and therefore (I assume) unsuitable to retrain as beasts of war.

~Theo

[philsidnell]

what graffito?

The one that started this thread, Phil!

D'oh! :oops:

Y'know I even scrolled back to the top and read the first posting, but still somehow missed the bit about the graffito, just skipped straight to the bit about elephants!

Phil Sidnell (who can read properly, honest!)

[D B Campbell]

But furry boots can one find a visual depiction of this graffiti?

For a Canadian, you've developed a splendid command of the Doric, Byron! :wink:

[Nicholas Gaukroger]

The HA depicts Julianus as a man with some military ability when it came to repelling barbarians from his provinces as a Praetor.

Lets be honest, beating the northern barbarians wasn't actually very difficult for Roman armies for most of the time - I don't think it tells you too much about military ability.

[Theodosius the Great]

The HA depicts Julianus as a man with some military ability when it came to repelling barbarians from his provinces as a Praetor.

Lets be honest, beating the northern barbarians wasn't actually very difficult for Roman armies for most of the time - I don't think it tells you too much about military ability.

I tend to agree. I try pointing this out to admirers of Julian the Apostate who continue uphold him as some sort of military genius. :roll:

At any rate, Didius Julianus' successes on the Danube impressed Commodus so much that he awarded him a Consulship. :lol:

~Theo

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

But furry boots can one find a visual depiction of this graffiti?

For a Canadian, you've developed a splendid command of the Doric, Byron! :wink:

Obviously not good enough to get a straight answer tho' :lol: :wink:

[PMBardunias]

I recently came across an article on Sassanid War-elephants. The journal escapes me because I don't have access to this year's articles yet, but I'll happily share when I do.

[kistlerj]

I see that in the past there has been some discussion and questions regarding elephants in battle.

I wrote that book War Elephants (Praeger 2005) and would be happy to answer any questions. Elephants are my favorite thing on earth, so always pleased to talk about them.

One question I saw was that someone believes elephants were always misemployed. That is certainly not the case. I would estimate that in about half of the battles elephants fought, they were well or correctly deployed. That is not to say they won have their battles. Even correctly deployed elephants are subject to the many vaguaries of war, accidents, traps, and brilliant enemies who overcome correct deployments by the use of unusual or clever tactics.

The best use for elephants throughout history has been for stopping cavalry. Horses simply will not approach the pachyderms, and therefore they are a perfect cavalry screen. (Years of training will allow you to coordinate your cavalry with elephants, the enemy rarely has that opportunity).

I am new to the forum and happy to see some ancient history buffs around!

John K

[D B Campbell]

I am new to the forum and happy to see some ancient history buffs around!

Welcome to RAT, John.

We don't have your book in the library here (Glasgow). Does it, by any chance, list the battles involving elephants? That would be a useful resource, I think.

[kistlerj]

Yes, the book (just came out in paperback if you want a cheaper copy) is exhaustive for battles in the western world. So every classical battle is here, and I provided a map showing their approximate locations. I cannot claim the same for Asian battles with elephants which were more frequent, but I could not locate those in most cases (Asian languages are beyond me).
There is no list, per se, but the chapters and contents are in chronological order so it would not be difficult to create a list.
John K

[kistlerj]

I see an old post where a member was puzzled by the problem with the elephants at the Rhone, when Hannibal tried to get them across.

After studying all the accounts and theories, the solution to my mind is quite simple, regarding the history of those particular elephants.

The Carthaginians may have bought a few Asian elephants via Syria or Egypt, but a majority of their elephants were the African Forest elephants still found in North Africa at the time. Yes, they do know how to swim, most likely.

However, these elephants had been owned Hamilcar, Hannibal's father, and kept in Spain for decades. It is quite possible that these elephants had been captured young and so either did not know how to swim or forgot how, since the region in Spain where the elephants were kept was hardly a land of many waters. The Rhone was simply the first huge body of water most of the elephants had ever seen, at least 100 meters across. Elephants eyesight is poor, they could not even see the other side.

In essence then the elephants of Hannibal were not practiced swimmers. However, when they charged off the rafts half way across, they did discover that they could swim very easily, as they are amazingly buoyant. Unfortunately, the mahouts (riders) pretty much all drowned, so it was a disaster for the elephant corps, and Hannibal had to find new riders. That made the Alps all the more difficult, and is probably why all but one elephant died after the Trebbia battle. Inexperienced riders who did not know how to care for the beasts in the Alps or in the battle.

That is basically what I wrote in one of the chapters of the War Elephants book.

John K

[Mitra]

Hi John

Great book, I have signalled this past year

http://www.romanarmy.nl/rat/viewtopic.p ... 50838f1879