Memoirs of Hadrian: The Movie

[Aethelfrith]

I'd like to say a word in defence of Excalibur - it is no worse than any other attempt to put Arthur (certainly not the woeful most recent attempt) on screen and does get some sense of the mysticism. There is a "The adventures of the Young Arthur' or something like that which was very good - had Brian Blessed and that guy from The Smuggler in it - a BBC production.

Cheers

Murray

I loved 'Excalibur' even though I would much prefer an era accurate version of the Arthurian legends (don't get me wrong, though, I loathe Monmouth's version and hated the way he portrayed the English but I have a fascination with the British-English war for the dominance of the isles). It had the best Merlin and the best Arthur for sure and a nice touch of surrealism. I also love the music Boorman used!

The best thing about the film is that it has no offencive portrayals of the English and doesn't ever say that King Arthur is King of England instead of a British Kingdom, the land of Arthur is simply called the ''Land''; a clever touch.

[Virilis]

Yourcenar. One of the few really convincing novels about Antiquity.

That`s true, in addition to Gore Vidal`s great "Julian".

[Jona Lendering]

Yourcenar. One of the few really convincing novels about Antiquity.

That`s true, in addition to Gore Vidal`s great "Julian".

For a moment I was tempted to open a thread asking for "which other great novels are there?", but I suspected that somebody would start to mention "good reads", so I decided to leave it. But you are absolutely right about Vidal's Julian - which is indeed a superior piece of modern literature. Being Dutch, I would add Simon Vestdijk, De nadagen van Pilatus, which is much more profound and psychologically more convincing than the better-known I Claudius (review in Dutch).

[Marcus F.]

What do you think of the idea that Daniel Craig should play Hadrian?

[Jona Lendering]

What do you think of the idea that Daniel Craig should play Hadrian?

He's a very good James Bond, but not a Hadrian. The worst news about this movie is that they have invited Valerio Manfredi. It's incredible. In the first place: if you decide to make a movie about a book, why ask someone to change it? Imagine you're making a movie about, say, the Iliad, and invite someone to change the plot.

And why Manfredi?! If you have that splendid book by Yourcenar, which is serene and distinguished and presents a "round character", why ask an author who is notorious for its vulgar Alexander books, his flat characters, and that "Last legion" story?!

I am really shocked. Seriously - I am not exaggerating or making a joke. This is really bad news. Just imagine that Visconti, when he was making Death in Venice, decided to leave the Thomas Mann novella, and asked a pornographer to improve the script. I have a feeling that they are now doing something similar to one of the most beautiful novels of the twentieth century. As a Dutch poet once wrote: All things valuable are defenceless. I am confused and sad.

(Of course, comparing Manfredi to a pornographer is an insult to pornography.)

[Theodosius the Great]

What do you think of the idea that Daniel Craig should play Hadrian?

He's a very good James Bond, but not a Hadrian. The worst news about this movie is that they have invited Valerio Manfredi. It's incredible. In the first place: if you decide to make a movie about a book, why ask someone to change it? Imagine you're making a movie about, say, the Iliad, and invite someone to change the plot.

And why Manfredi?! If you have that splendid book by Yourcenar, which is serene and distinguished and presents a "round character", why ask an author who is notorious for its vulgar Alexander books, his flat characters, and that "Last legion" story?!

I am really shocked. Seriously - I am not exaggerating or making a joke. This is really bad news. Just imagine that Visconti, when he was making Death in Venice, decided to leave the Thomas Mann novella, and asked a pornographer to improve the script. I have a feeling that they are now doing something similar to one of the most beautiful novels of the twentieth century. As a Dutch poet once wrote: All things valuable are defenceless. I am confused and sad.

(Of course, comparing Manfredi to a pornographer is an insult to pornography.)

Yikes....

Not that I had hopes for this film but it sounds like another Caligula in the works ? hock:

The parallel would be complete if they did hire a top Brit actor like Craig, it seems.

~Theo

[Tarbicus]

Daniel Craig is an excellent actor, and I think would make a great Hadrian. If you haven't seen the likes of Enduring Love and The Mother your image of him may be a little one sided. He can command a role brilliantly and highly intelligently, and I'd look forward to what he can do with the role of Hadrian. There are too many stereotypical leads IMHO.

Here's what I think: If the film goes ahead, and Craig plays Hadrian, I predict he'll be up for an Oscar. That's how good I think Craig is with the right material.

[Jona Lendering]

If the film goes ahead, and Craig plays Hadrian, I predict he'll be up for an Oscar. That's how good I think Craig is with the right material.

I hope you're right, but asking Manfredi to change a script by Yourcenar can hardly create "the right material. I mean: if you have a perfect idea, you simply mustn't change it. They're changing a winning team. Worse, they are asking the changes to be made by someone who simply has no sense for the dignity of the original, and will make something, well, Hollywood. They might as well have asked Britney Spears and Mariah Carey for the roles of Plotina and Sabina.

[Narukami]

You are quite correct Tarbicus, Daniel Craig is an excellent actor. I would recommend his performance in Infamous as another example of his range and ability to inhabit a role, even an unsavory one.

However, Jona's concerns are, I fear, well founded. Good actors can make marginal material into something better than it perhaps deserves to be, but a writer of little wit or artistry can derail even the best actors.

Film is just the medium -- if the story is poorly done then all the efforts of the other artists are spent not enhancing the story but trying desperately to correct the faults of the writer.

As Akira Kurosawa did for the samurai film, so we need an artist to do the same for films about ancient Rome. Who that person is I do not know.

We can hope for the best on this new film, and as always, time will tell.

:?

Narukami

[john m roberts]

Novels may be altered significantly in adaptation to film without making a bad film. Most people are not aware how austere a film script is compared to narrative prose. Consider these films compared with the novels upon which they were based:
The Godfather
L.A. Confidential
Each was based on a sprawling novel from which vast sequences were excised to create a screenplay. Each film was a masterpiece.
Incidentally, I'm now adapting Flaubert's "Salammbo" for a screenplay. It's a brutal exercise in cutting away extraneous verbiage while keeping the basic story and the stunning visual imagery. That's the art of film adaptation.

[Wander]

Well, according to the following commenter on IMDB, Boorman is saying Banderas will not be Hadrian: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0467470/board/nest/75893021

...but the second link he cites still says Banderas is in it, and the first link isn't working for me.

The next story, in Variety, has Boorman "reviving" the project as of July 28: http://www.variety.com/article/VR111798 ... 1&nid=2562

And the story below, dated yesterday, has Daniel Craig as Hadrian: http://www.freshnews.in/daniel-craig-to ... rian-39590

(They seem to be really focused on the bisexual aspect, at least in the press.)

[Jona Lendering]

Novels may be altered significantly in adaptation to film without making a bad film. ... That's the art of film adaptation.

True, but in good movies the essence of the book is maintained. Visconti's movies are a case in point. I am not convinced that Manfredi is up to the job.

His Alexander trilogy gave me the shivers; this man is uncapable of understanding -let alone rendering- the subtleties and contradictions of hellenism, which is probably the main issue you have to tackle if you want to understand Yourcenar's Hadrian. The man is a self-appointed Greek.

The second issue is the aspect that Tertullian so famously summarized: Hadrian was omnium curiositatum explorator. Manfredi's treatment of the exotic in his Alexander books suggests that he will explore the sensational aspect, again missing the core of Yourcenar's Hadrian.

Manfredi simply has no "sense" for the aristocratic nature of Hadrian. I fear he will present us with a Hadrian that is a homosexual lover, instead of the Hadrian of Yourcenar - a melancholic, serene, and cruel philhellene.

Visconti could have done it; perhaps Scorsese; but not Boorman/Manfredi. Given Boorman's singularly bad taste for music (Carmina Burana in Excalibur), I expect we will see Antinous drowning and will hear the Adagietto from Mahler's Fifth. Music for the masses.

[D B Campbell]

And the story below, dated yesterday, has Daniel Craig as Hadrian: http://www.freshnews.in/daniel-craig-to ... rian-39590

"... famous for building the wall dividing Scotland from the Great Britain" ?! :roll:

[Sean Manning]

Yourcenar. One of the few really convincing novels about Antiquity.

That`s true, in addition to Gore Vidal`s great "Julian".

For a moment I was tempted to open a thread asking for "which other great novels are there?", but I suspected that somebody would start to mention "good reads", so I decided to leave it. But you are absolutely right about Vidal's Julian - which is indeed a superior piece of modern literature. Being Dutch, I would add Simon Vestdijk, De nadagen van Pilatus, which is much more profound and psychologically more convincing than the better-known I Claudius (review in Dutch).

Its not great literature, just a great book, but I'll always have a soft spot for L. Sprague de Camp's Lest Darkness Fall (1939). De Camp was always a keen student of human nature with a respect for historical fact. I'll have to read Gore Vidal's books and I, Claudius some day.

[D B Campbell]

De Camp was always a keen student of human nature with a respect for historical fact.

Agreed. I had some interesting correspondence with Sprague in the 1990s. The man was already in his 80s but he was as sharp as a tack with an encyclopedic knowledge of antiquity and an enthusiasm to share. He sent me a copy of his The Ancient Engineers when it was unavailable in UK.