A Basque ironclad in the 16th century...?

[Eleatic Guest]

Just curious, who has Kurlansky, Mark. 1999. The Basque History of the World. Walker & Company, New York. ISBN 0-8027-1349-1, p. 56 at hand?

What kind of ship was commissioned there? A real ironclad? What source does the author rely on?

[Eleatic Guest]

Please see also here: http://www.romanarmy.com/rat/viewtopic. ... 415#222415

[Antonius Lupus]

This is the Spanish Wikipedia article on Juan Lezcano:

http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_de_Lezcano

En la toma de Mazalquivir, para facilitar el desembarco de las tropas forra a su nave con sacos de lana...

My translation:

During the siege of Mazalquivir (Algeria, 1505), in order to facilitate the landing of troops, he covers his ship with wool sacks.

Kurlansky talks of metal plating. Well, someone got his/her sources wrong. Knowing the Spanish Wikipedia, much much more unreliable than the English one, I would point my finger at them, but that is my opinion.

In the pdf of Aznar Vallejo at the end of the Wiki's page...

http://um.gipuzkoakultura.net/itsasmemo ... allejo.pdf

... it says on page 48 that the ships were galeotas. Nothing is said about the metal plating or the sacks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galiot

[Eleatic Guest]

Gracias Antonio.

Parece que, como siempre, haya tres diferentes opiniones por dos autores. ;-) )

[Eleatic Guest]

Just curious, who has Kurlansky, Mark. 1999. The Basque History of the World. Walker & Company, New York. ISBN 0-8027-1349-1, p. 56 at hand? What source does the author rely on?

I looked it up and the book does not use any footnotes. Dead end. Sad.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Has anyone heard of the Korean Turtle ships?

They were heavily armoured ships in an invasion fleet heading for Japan
which was sunk by a Tsunami, or divine wind, can't recall the exact century.

[Eleatic Guest]

Has anyone heard of the Korean Turtle ships?

They were heavily armoured ships in an invasion fleet heading for Japan
which was sunk by a Tsunami, or divine wind, can't recall the exact century.

The iron-cladding of the turtle ships is almost certainly a myth. Not a single contemporary Korean sources does mention a metal roof, including the war diary of the supposed inventor himself, admiral Yun-sin, and the war account of his nephew.

Samuel Hawley has recently done an admirable job to point out the flimsiness of the evidence. Download his findings here ("Frühe Schiffpanzerung.rar"): http://www.webfilehost.com/?mode=viewupload&id=4506066

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I cannot download the files.

But, having lived in Asia, and having my parents live in Korea for alost 4 years, think it is possible they may have picked a few points on the culture and history of the place.

I think I recall this from my asian history classes of over 20 years ago,
but maybe not.

Is the file in english or German?

[Eleatic Guest]

I cannot download the files.

English. Go to "Click here to download" below or give me your email address via PN. :-) )

[Iagoba]

That would be a real basque ironclad, ¿No? :lol:

[Timotheus]

Just imagine the amount of work and materials needed in the 16th century to armor plate even a small ship. With the technology available it could take years to produce that much iron armor.

I bet production capabilities alone would kill the Basques or the Koreans doing this.

[Eleatic Guest]

I bet production capabilities alone would kill the Basques or the Koreans doing this.

I addressed that point, too, at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turtle_ship (go to the section "decking"). But be quick; since the ironcladding of the turtle ships is a national matter of faith in Korea, and as such less susceptible to reason, the section might be altered soon.

[Eleatic Guest]

To our Dutch friends: What do you know about the Finis Bellis, a Dutch ship or rather floating platform during the Spanish siege of Antwerp in 1585, which is said to have been partially protected with iron plates? Any details in Dutch books?

My source: J. Rudlov: "Die Einführung der Panzerung im Kriegschiffbau und die Entwicklung der ersten Panzerflotten", Beiträge zur Geschichte der Technik und Industrie, Vol. 2, No. 1 (1910)