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Some Sarauter revisionism
#36
Archelaos, I disagree. The sauroter from tomb 3 was not of the winged type. It was squared like conventional sauroters. I have seen much smaller smaller sauroters,both bronze and iron, from all eras! The tiniest i have ever seen come from Amphipolis,they were hellenistic,however they were identical in size and shape with hellenistic sculptures,like those from Pergamos.
In addition,the greaves that were found in the same tomb were no smaller than normal. No smaller than other greaves. The youth that was burried was supposedly about 13-14 years old,some children that age are not much shorter than other adults. So I don't see the use of any shorter model of a spear for parade!

The placement of the porpax has to do with two factors: The antilabe being near the rim (one spot) and the need for the hoplite to rest his shieldon on his shoulder while having his arm in a natural position.(two spots)
This drawing makes my point:
[Image: porpax-placing.gif][Image: arm6.jpg]
Now why some are off centered and some others not? Again two factors. First,the artist have beem accurate in showing both types of porpakes,and they must have been accurate in another thing: There was no specific rule for the size of the shield for each individual. Some shields almost reach the knees when the shield is resting. Some others barely cover all the thigh etc. So for the same man it is obvious that a smaller shield would require a more centered porpax,keeping the two rules above for the placment of the porpax.
The second factor is of course the individual's arm size. A man with long arms would have a more centered porpax for the same shield than a man with short arms. Similarly a man with a big shield and short arms would have a very off centered porpax while a man with smaller shield and long arms would have a centered porpax.
Small differences in arm lenght wouldn't make the shields unusuable by others,of course. You would just be more uncomfortable to rest the shield on your shoulder, and changing the rope of the antilabe would adjust the grip to the individual's will.
Lastly,there are even some other minor factors,like for example the antilabe is usually very near the rim,but how near varies every time,and in some rare occasions it isn't near at all.
And a more last note, if you have the porpax off centered, because of the width of your upper arm,it happenes that you don't hold the shield from the center of balance,but your upper arm is actually in the center vertically,so you're receiving blows and you can push with your arm being in the center actually. And although i have not tested it myself,it could also be that the vertically off centered porpax makes the shield "hung" better, like an apron from your arm.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ancientgre ... 133671216/


Apologies for the VERY off-topic but since we happened to discuss it again here...

Khairete
Giannis
Giannis K. Hoplite
a.k.a.:Giannis Kadoglou
a.k.a.:Thorax
[Image: -side-1.gif]
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Messages In This Thread
Some Sarauter revisionism - by Kineas - 06-03-2009, 11:38 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Matthew Amt - 06-03-2009, 02:05 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-03-2009, 04:16 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-03-2009, 06:56 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Kineas - 06-03-2009, 07:24 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by hoplite14gr - 06-03-2009, 09:15 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Kineas - 06-04-2009, 12:18 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-04-2009, 01:44 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-04-2009, 02:35 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-04-2009, 08:01 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Peter Raftos - 06-04-2009, 10:23 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Kineas - 06-04-2009, 11:01 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Peter Raftos - 06-04-2009, 12:20 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by hoplite14gr - 06-04-2009, 06:09 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Kineas - 06-04-2009, 07:42 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by hoplite14gr - 06-04-2009, 07:57 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-04-2009, 08:25 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-04-2009, 11:03 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-05-2009, 04:09 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-05-2009, 04:23 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-05-2009, 04:04 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Matthew Amt - 06-05-2009, 04:26 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-05-2009, 04:40 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-06-2009, 05:43 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-07-2009, 07:07 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-07-2009, 09:26 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-11-2009, 06:08 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-13-2009, 03:44 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-13-2009, 04:39 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Giannis K. Hoplite - 06-13-2009, 05:54 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-13-2009, 07:48 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-13-2009, 09:57 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-15-2009, 12:37 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 06-15-2009, 01:11 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-15-2009, 02:12 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-15-2009, 03:27 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Archelaos - 06-15-2009, 08:32 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Paullus Scipio - 06-15-2009, 10:21 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 07-15-2009, 03:30 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 07-15-2009, 03:34 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Lýsandros - 07-15-2009, 05:46 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 07-15-2009, 08:42 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by Lýsandros - 07-16-2009, 09:17 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 07-16-2009, 11:24 AM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by hoplite14gr - 07-16-2009, 06:23 PM
Re: Some Sarauter revisionism - by PMBardunias - 09-20-2009, 01:57 AM

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