Naked in the bath house

[Memmia]

Hi,

I am sure I read a source somewhere which stated that some more modest (or self conscious) people wore a linen shift in the bath house rather than bathe completely naked. Does anyone have any info regarding this ?

Thanks in advance

[Jona Lendering]

I am sure I read a source somewhere which stated that some more modest (or self conscious) people wore a linen shift in the bath house rather than bathe completely naked. Does anyone have any info regarding this ?

Unfortunately I can only help you to sources that suggest that people were undressed, like the epigrams of Martial. Bathing customs must have varied regionally; I wonder about your source, and to what region it refers.

[Nathan Ross]

As Jona says, most of the evidence tends towards naked bathing at all times. The latin word nudus doesn't necessarily mean completely naked, but rather 'undressed' - soldiers without their arms and belts are described as nudus, and they're still wearing tunics. Mosaic pictures of bathers do show both them and the attendant slaves as completely naked, though.

There are a couple of references to some kind of bath costume - Alexander Severus (as much of a prude as a Roman could be, with his prohibition of men and women bathing together!) is described as returning to the palace from the baths 'in his bathing-costume, retaining only this much of the emperor, namely, that he put on a scarlet cloak' (Hist Aug Alexander Severus 42), and Dio mentions that when Caracalla's tutor Cilo is arrested at the baths he is wearing only 'low slippers' and 'a short tunic' (Dio 78.4). But both these items of clothing might have been worn in the palaestra outside the baths, for exercising, rather than inside the bathhouse itself.

- Nathan

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

Wasnt it Vespasianus who forbade mixed bathing because of indecent behaviour ?

M.VIB.M.

[Astiryu1]

Wasnt it Vespasianus who forbade mixed bathing because of indecent behaviour ?

M.VIB.M.

Sorry! I shall make this quick but feel it must be said... Here goes!

Guy had to go and ruin it for the rest of us!!! :twisted:

I think we should as a people encourage bathing as much as possible. There isn't much more you can do than than have bathing with the opposite sexes for encouragement. Bring back the bath house even if we have to wear clothing... Who's with me!!! :lol:

That said... I believe it would have been up to the person right? Or would they have separate sections like modern beaches?

[Epictetus]

I am sure I read a source somewhere which stated that some more modest (or self conscious) people wore a linen shift in the bath house rather than bathe completely naked. Does anyone have any info regarding this ?

I couldn’t find anything, but evidently some people were embarrassed to go nude. Juvenal in Satires 11 makes fun of a “raw youngster, untutored all his days” who goes to the bath and uses an “oil-flask to conceal his nudity.”

Wasnt it Vespasianus who forbade mixed bathing because of indecent behaviour ?

Hadrian is credited with creating separate bath-times for the sexes (HA, Hadrian, 18.9). Evidently there is an inscription from Lusitania that details times (CIL II 518I, l. 19ff).

Carcopino says that the complexes were open to everyone from the fifth hour of the morning. After Hadrian’s decree, at the sixth hour the baths themselves opened to women while men had their turn from the eighth or ninth hour, depending upon if it was summer or winter. Some establishments were reserved only for women or only for men, though, so it was possible to bathe when one wanted.

[Nathan Ross]

Hadrian is credited with creating separate bath-times for the sexes (HA, Hadrian, 18.9).

You're quite right, it was Hadrian. Marcus Aurelius repeated the law (HA Marcus 23.8.), which implies that people were ignoring it . Elagabulus apparently made it legal again (surprisingly, he didn't make it compulsory...), but it was Alexander Severus that 'forbade the maintenance of baths used by both sexes' (HA Alex Severus 24.2).

The public baths in Pompeii date from the 1st C BC and have separate male and female sections, so clearly there was a division long before Hadrian. Presumably the smaller bathhouses were less scrupulous, and 'specialist' mixed bathing establishments may have existed too. There's a story in Aulus Gellius (Attic Nights X.3.3) about a consul's wife who wished to use the men's section at a provincial public baths (because it was bigger?), and the men were banned from using it while she was in there.

Juvenal in Satires 11 makes fun of a “raw youngster, untutored all his days” who goes to the bath and uses an “oil-flask to conceal his nudity.”

Also Martial (Epigrams 7.82), who mocks the athlete Menophilus for wearing a 'fibula' (apparently some kind of sheath) over his penis at the baths - the fibula falls off during some particularly strenous exercise and Menophilus is revealed to be circumcised... hock:

- Nathan

[Memmia]

Hi everyone!

Thankyou so so much for your replies to this. 8)
I cannot remember where I read the info about the linen shift that's why I asked just in case anyone else had seen it.
I am building up a 'bath house' collection for demonstration/ education purposes at our heritage site (Letocetum) and wanted as much info as possible.
All of this info is absolutely great.It will be good to quote this too rather than just go through a standard bath house repertoire.

Brilliant!
Thanks again to all of you