Skeleton provides clue to York\'s Roman amphitheatre

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

A skeleton of a Roman, who was stabbed to death, could be a clue in the search for York's Roman amphitheatre. The remains were discovered beneath the Yorkshire Museum during the museum's refurbishment. The skeleton is that of a large powerful, athletic male who was stabbed at least six times in a fatal attack. Where he was found has long thought to be one of the prime locations for the Roman amphitheatre that certainly would have existed in York....

....read the full article at the BBC
http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/york/hi/peo ... 272041.stm

[Vindex]

God help us!!! Is this the state of UK archaeology???

One skellie...six "unhealed" stab injuries...got to be a gladiator then!!

I really despair of the British press and private arcaheological company "press releases". Grab a headline and devil take the hindmost...

Are we about to see another apology sent to archaeology units like we did about the female gladiator and words taken "out of context"?

<deep, painful, sigh!>

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

So he wasn't murdered then, and his body hidden inside the fortress, he was definately a gladiator, and buried in the amphetheater, becuse gladiators were exempt from the rule of no burials within the forts/town? Riiiiiight! We should build a monument to him and perhaps, start a cult?

[Gaius Decius Aquilius]

I don’t suppose there is any information on where the stab wounds are? Some information could be in that. Size of the blade, and so on.

Multiple stab wounds are common on assaults with any kind of knife. I also include slash wounds with this. A determined/trained person with a knife can close on a targeted person within 20 feet in seconds, but the first wound is usually a slash. (In cop school we were told to expect to be cut, if attacked with a knife, and knife attacks are often more fatal than shootings. That is why cops try to keep a certain distance from anyone who we suspect may be dangerous, and have reason to believe are armed with a knife. This happened to me once. I was able to keep my distance and she dropped the knife. Happy ending for everyone. Understand this next time you are stopped. The cop is just exercising what he has been trained to to. ) When the aggressor gets within a close personal space, the knife strikes turn to stab wounds. Anyway, this is the usual case expected when conducting an investigation of modern knife related crimes. When only stab wounds are found it indicated the victim was taken by surprise, knew the attacker, or was possibly being held. There are, of course, many variations on a theme. On skeletal remains one would not expect many soft tissue wounds to be evident. Many stabbings involve many more than six wounds, with over a dozen being very common. A case where the victim is struggling will often leave many superficial soft tissue wounds. You can also expect to find them is "defensive" parts of the body such as the inside of the lower arm and hand, and fingers.

Such is life. One wonders why anyone living under the Pax Romana would show any signs of violence at all? If all the wounds are to the back, the attacker was probably a politician.

Ralph

EDIT: On a distant note, as I wrote the above, my wife just handed over to me my new Osprey Samurai Women 1184-1877. In 1868 the Aizu Brigade, made up uf women armed only with swords and naginata, charged Imperial troops armed with muskets. The Imperials held their fire hoping to capture the women. This allowed the Aizu Brigade to close on the Imperials and got inside their ranks and did a lot of sucessful slicing and dicing before withdrawing. In the close packed ranks, the sword was almost impossible to defend against, given the muskets with bayonets were lengthy and cumbersome in close quarters. Those of you who believe in the hasta, take note.

[Forty-One]

"The physical evidence reveals he was a swordsman..."

I'm rather sceptical that osteology is really able to determine that someone's muscular development is specifically from sword fighting and not, say, blacksmithing, humping loads down the docks or heavy agricultural work.

"...similar to other gladiators found in York"

Did I miss a memo?

[John Conyard]

Tourism is massive in York. Recently York Archaeological Trust unveiled some beheaded skeletons as "galdiators". They dressed some people up as ersatz gladiators, publicised it all, and it gave them a nice boost in terms of visitor numbers to their attractions. Which in turn earns money which can hopefully be used for further archaeological investigation. Now it seems York museums Trust have their own gladiator, which we help them in the battle for visitor numbers.

All cut throat stuff

[Robert Vermaat]

Any reason (besides tourism) why the man could not have been a soldier killed in some fighting (are the remains dated yet?) during York's Roman history?

Those of you who believe in the hasta, take note.

Those who believe in the hasta always a) carry a big scutum and b) always carry a sidearm, which the musket-brigade apparently did neither.

[Forty-One]

Any reason (besides tourism) why the man could not have been a soldier killed in some fighting (are the remains dated yet?) during York's Roman history?

I'd have thought that statistically he's more likely a civilian victim of street violence or murder. "Big drunken navvy pisses someone off and gets chibbed outside the cauponium at chucking out time", doesn't sound as sexy as "gladiator killed in a bloody duel in the arena" or "brave centurion killed fighting off the man-eating picts", I suppose.

Those of you who believe in the hasta, take note.

Those who believe in the hasta always a) carry a big scutum and b) always carry a sidearm, which the musket-brigade apparently did neither.

The most common weapon in Samurai armies for all of their pre-gunpowder history was yari - spears, so they obviously "believed in the hasta" too.

[john m roberts]

It would be nice if people weren't so obsessed with gladiators. What we have here is a great Classical murder mystery. Multiple stabs are to be expected. Only in movies does a tough, determined fighter get stabbed once and obligingly keel over dead. You keep stabbing until he's no longer a threat. If possible, you do it from behind. If from in front, have at least two friends to hold him while you work. Best of all is to catch him asleep or passed out drunk. If the skeleton was found within the walls, then the body was concealed. Interesting stuff.
addendum: On the other hand, the article seems to say that the skeleton was found on a site long thought to be where York's amphitheater was located, and amphitheaters (except for the Colosseum) were usually located outside of towns, not within them.

[John Conyard]

I think there is a general feeling that the amphitheater lies to the west of the city.

The skeleton was found to the east of the fort in what is considered an annex to the fortress, the wagon park etc.

[Medusa Gladiatrix]

Got some more ;-) )

http://www.pasthorizons.com/index.php/a ... phitheatre
http://www.yorkshiremuseum.org.uk/Page/ ... ticleId=37

Looks like not only the press is jumping on this "gladiator" topic but also the museum itself, maybe to lure more visitors into the museum.

@ John: Is the picture of the town supposed to be Roman York?

[John Conyard]

Yes, a possible interpretation of the city. The fortress to the north, the vicus to south side of the river, the "wagon park" to the west and an amphitheatre to the east. The principia is under the present day Cathedral.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Well, murder seems more likely...I guess another reason to visit York again. :roll:

[John Conyard]

We have murders all the time! Be careful.

When you visit York again you may be kidnapped by a leading archaeological/museums trust and put on display as a gladiator exhibit. Thousands of people will stare at your remains and documentaries will be made explaining your swordsman physique, your foreign DNA, your muscle development and your demise. 8)

But of course you are welcome for coffee!

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

But of course you are welcome for coffee!

Before or after the murder....?