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Hello, I wasn't sure what to class my question under but it is a reconstruction so here is,
In the link provided ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPV0yMCr1Io ) you will watch this man making a segmentata hinge, and if you look closely enough, you will see that it's purposefully made so that the two rivet plates of the hinge are not equally horizontal.
Like a step one is higher than the other. Is this to assist the overlapping of the shoulder plates, one being tucked under the one above? As if the hinge was made level, it would be pressuring on the hinge to have the metal at equal level, and force the lower plate to tuck under the one above. Making any sense?
Last, is this a good recreation? Historically and logistically?
Many thanks in advance,
Sam
Samuel J.
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We'll let you know, once you've provided the link and we have all perused it and had a good laugh...errm I mean examined it and formed a learned opinion.... :grin:
But really, where the link? 8)
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
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Byron Angel
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isn't it the video that's presented?
Samuel J.
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I do see the point that you are making about the offset of the two hinge plates, and in fact the reason being for the overlap of Segmentata plates.
It is indeed a method that I have used in the past when making Segmentata that I have to say does also take the pressure off the hinge plate rivets, which is of course cheating for the hinges of the Corbridge hoard shows that they were level with each other along with the hinge pin being uppermost.
However I was not impressed at all with that guys workshop practice methods, in fact I would not even let him near a workshop of mine when we see just how he uses tools. I think that I have to ask the question about that hacksaw blade and if it had any teeth on it at all, for it looked as if he was burning his way through the metal and come to that just where in the world did he ever learn how to use a hacksaw like a seesaw in fact I was very surprised to see that he had any fingers left by the end of the vidio.
Brian Stobbs
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No I can't see a video, just a big empty space in your post! :-?
Must be just me!
But going by Brians post, I can say he made a seg for me, and it is excellent, and the hinges have stood up well, and without undue stresses on them. I agree, the guy who made the corbridge hinges was not top of his class....Brian would have taught him quite a bit! :grin:
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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Brian,
I couldn't agree more with you about his poor labor, it utmost sucked, but I'm not a cruel person and was open to any advice on hinges. As I can't dedicate the time to a segmentata, it's not a bad idea to make the hinges without further due notice. I am uploading my latest work for my scabbard. Thank you for your replies, as this method isn't entirely correct, but works well, tell me what is suggested for me to follow please. He used a kick plate I understand, in solid brass?! Well, trying to think of correct thickness...huh...
Many thanks! Sam!
Samuel J.
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I was looking at one of the other videos that shows the bending of the girdle plates, this is where the guy was just sitting bending them across his thigh.
There is nothing wrong with this method however it is not the way that I prefer to do this part of a Segmentata, I use a hammering method that creates a stressed curve to the plate makeing it much stronger.
It is where I can make a .6mm thick plate as strong as any .9mm or even a 1.2mm plate, if we look at the segmentata found at Corbridge it becomes clear that the metal used was more in the region of .6mm it only looks thicker due to the expansion rust.
The method is to use a metal block and place the straight plate onto the block and then hammer the plate on its inside back and forth over the width of the plate and it will automaticaly begin to bend into the required shape, infact it becomes a situation where the bend becomes permanent or stressed and much stronger against any blows from the side.
Brian Stobbs
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Ah very good, so my repeatedly hammering the plate on "an anvil" it will begin to curve? And how about dents, or thinning the metal too much?
Sam
Samuel J.
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I couldn't help noticing that he has made quite a muddle of the armour. He has made a Corbridge segmentata with Kalkriese fittings and a main shoulder plates which appear to be a weird interpretation of the Chichester plate, as well as what seems to be a Newstead type with Corbridge fittings. :roll:
Crispvs
Who is called \'\'Paul\'\' by no-one other than his wife, parents and brothers. :!: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" />:!:
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This hammering of a girdle plate and of course all the other Segmentata plates is where one does not hammer the metal too heavy, it is what I would call learning all about a thing I call hammer bounze.
In fact where we look at the video of the riveting carried out on the hinge pin the guy is holding the hammer far to near to the head and this is not the correct way to use any hammer.
What I mean by hammer bounze is where one needs to learn how to hold their elbow against their rib cage and only use the wrist as the fulcrum point of the swing, this also becomes a way that when peening a rivet the hammer falls at the same place all of the time.
It is also where one has to listen to the hammer blows and with practise holding it correctly we can hear three to four beats on the metal for only one downward swing.
Then there is also a correct hammer for every type of job for this is why they have different weights, for curving of these plates a four ounce should be ample and letting the hammer do the work not smashing it down with the arm.
Brian Stobbs
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Very good Philus, well said. I shall practice it when I get to that. I do have trouble with making those gosh darn rivets from a brass rod! So stubborn! Yes Crispvs, tut tut tut, such a mix up! :x :x :x :x
Sam
Samuel J.
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Where it comes to most Roman hinges we find that they used soft iron for the hinge pins, a good substitute when making them is to use soft wire nails.
Then a very good idea is to drill a metal block put in the piece of wire nail peen one end of this and then there is only one end to peen when they are used.
Brian Stobbs
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He might be aiming for a multicultural, politically correct, historically inclusive impression, Crispvs. Admirable 21st century thinking, eh?
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Wow. What did his anvil ever do to him to deserve his obvious mistreatment. As a metalsmith I am a mandatory reporter for tool abuse. Just goes to show you, you can accomplish quite a bit, and still not know how to really use or take care of your tools. I am sad for the anvils. I too would never let him within 100 feet of my shop.
Dean Cunningham,
Metalsmith, Father, dilettante
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That is very true Dean but it's not just his anvil for I was interested watching the Vice going back and forth as he was trying hard to use his hacksaw, I wonder if anyone has ever told him that a vice has to be fixed firmly to a bench.
PS Then oh OMG like you I could cry also seeing that Anvil.
Brian Stobbs
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