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Most of the roman fabric tent from the reenacter groups are made with white fabric (mainly linen?) with no particular reason.<br>
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Why not to build a coloured tent? Bright red, Green, blue? With designs?<br>
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Opinions are welcome!<br>
<p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub45.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=luca@romanarmytalk>Luca</A> <IMG HEIGHT=10 WIDTH=10 SRC="http://www.romanhideout.com/legiov/Images/lucamain.jpg" BORDER=0> at: 2/20/04 1:20 pm<br></i>
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Maybe the fact is that we all feel that they are not really 'authentic' and a dull colour can help to make them look like leather tents at mid-distance...<br>
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Aitor <p></p><i></i>
It\'s all an accident, an accident of hands. Mine, others, all without mind, from one extreme to another, but neither works nor will ever.
Rolf Steiner
Why bother dying them? Too much work considering a legion would have how many tents? <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix" Coh I<br>
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"Lay your hand, or thy tongue against the greatness of Rome, and feel my wrath." - Matt Lanteigne<br>
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Yeah, the tents should be leather, so the better option is to paint the fabric ones brown. Legio III Gallica in New Orleans did that, and it came out pretty impressively. Even harder-core would be to paint a bunch of canvas, cut it into rectangular panels, and sew together to look even more like the goatskin ones.<br>
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As for decorating tents in general, I don't see why not! After all, the shields and other personal gear are all decorated, and there are only 1/8 as many tents in a legion as shields. Luckily, there is really no evidence for decorated tents (except maybe the higher officers), so we're safe on that one.<br>
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Valete,<br>
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Matthew/Quintus <p></p><i></i>
Matthew Amt (Quintus)
Legio XX, USA
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Yes, why not!<br>
After all, the surviving leather panels come from watterlogged deposits, where all traces from dyeing disappear.<br>
We can be sure that no embroidered decoration was present on them but we'll never know if the panels were alternatively coloured red and white or whatever crazy combination that could come to our minds!<br>
<br>
Aitor <p></p><i></i>
It\'s all an accident, an accident of hands. Mine, others, all without mind, from one extreme to another, but neither works nor will ever.
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Luca,<br>
There may be no such thing a an actual linen Roman tent, at least in Imperial times for legionaries and junior officers. This is because linen tents become water proof only after they are saturated with water, and the problem is that once a linen tent is completely saturated it will be too heavy for one mule to carry. This is why the Roman army went to such great expense using oiled goat or calveskin. If properly oiled, the water will bead off the leather as if it were a rubber sheet, and therefore weigh the same, whether wet or not.<br>
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The myth of the linen roman military tent is perpetuated by groups who do not want to invest in an authentic tent. If they do go the cheap route, they should at least 'fake it' and paint the canvas so it resemble leather.<br>
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On another matter, I am curious why you do not have our LEG XIIII on your webpage listing of Roman units. It is the oldest in the world after the ESG drill team, (so technically the 'first' real Roman reenactment group). It is also one of the largest, having brought over 40 fully equipped men to Albano, with additional equipment for 6 cavalrymen and 15 additional earlier and later period equipments for roman soldier evolution displays (not to mention 3 leather tents, catapult, cataphract armor, Roman saddle, etc. ) The majority of the so called Roman "groups" you have listed are often little more than a legion number, a centurion, his best friend, and his kid sister, oh, and a web site of course, which is apparently the most important thing. I don't have time for that.<br>
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Dan <br>
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Dan <p></p><i></i>
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Supersorry Dan!<br>
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I don't know why your link is lost! Now your group is listed together with other "familiar" groups.... :-)<br>
It could be fine to make a sort of ranking of the groups separating them following some criteria as for example the foundation date, number of partecipants, log of events, etc. but could be too complicate and require too many energies to be maintained.<br>
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Many thanks for your observations about the leather! <p></p><i></i>
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Avete<br>
<br>
We have 14 canvas tents and never considered painting them to look like leather because in our opinion, painted/stained/dyed canvas does not look like oiled vegetable tanned goatskin. To us it looks like painted/stained/dyed canvas.<br>
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We prefer to explain our predominant use of canvas in relation to costs and time and then use our handsewn goatskin tentage to illustrate that point.<br>
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Please, pardon this reference, but it's funny to some of us, the idea of painting canvas to look like leather, because of our SCA experience. That sort of reasoning has been an SCA "excuse" for as long as I can remember...<br>
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SCA examples: sateen fabric looks like silk, or brown plastic plant border edging looks like leather, or burnished aluminum looks like CR mild steel, or .. well, trust me it's an enourmous list...<br>
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Though in practical terms painted canvas lasts many years longer than plain canvas especially if you intend to leave it up for weeks at a time.<br>
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Hibernicus<br>
LEG IX HSPA USA<br>
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<p></p><i></i>
Hibernicus
LEGIO IX HISPANA, USA
You cannot dig ditches in a toga!
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Quote:The myth of the linen roman military tent is perpetuated by groups who do not want to invest in an authentic tent. If they do go the cheap route, they should at least 'fake it' and paint the canvas so it resemble leather.
yeah, sure would be nice to have that kinda money! When you're married all the $$$ for the über-fun stuff kinda just goes away and ya gotta make it work. I DO like the idea of painting the tent to look like leather. When I win the lotto, I will buy 3 leather tents, but until then...
DECIMvS MERCATIvS VARIANvS
a.k.a.: Marsh Wise
Legio IX Hispana www.legioix.org
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A couple of years ago we painted one of our tents brown, not so much as to make it look like leather but more to make it look less like canvas. Once the paint was dry the fabric was much stiffer (and it remains so) and the surface colour was slightly uneven. Although initially some of us felt that it looked worse than it did before, a number of members of the public (who are never allowed to get within the perimeter fence we erect around our tents and fires) have mistaken it for leather, some even commenting what a good idea it is to use a leather tent. Obviously we do not get that sort of comment from most spectators, but then again, most spectators don't bother to comment anyway. If a few people have learned something then painting the tent brown was probably worth while.<br>
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Crispvs <p></p><i></i>
Who is called \'\'Paul\'\' by no-one other than his wife, parents and brothers. :!: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" />:!:
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Crispus,<br>
I agree that it is better to paint a roman tent then to leave it white canvas. As you have pointed out, from a distance a good paint job will suggest leather, andeven if they do not look quite right close up, if Roman reenactors are ever used to a large degree in motion pictures, like Civil War and WWII reenactors, brown tents in the background will look a lot better in films than white canvas.<br>
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Although I haven't tried it, I believe some acrylic or latex paints if applied heavily, will "fill" the weaving of the canvas to suggest a leather appearance. Another possibility is to find a simulated leather which is nearly as cheap as canvas.<br>
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All of this may now be solved however, for deepeeka has made its first leather tent. It is a large centurion model, special ordered for me, but if it turned out okay, they have plans for legionary papillo if there is enugh interest out there.<br>
<br>
Dan <p></p><i></i>
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Quote:All of this may now be solved however, for deepeeka has made its first leather tent. It is a large centurion model, special ordered for me, but if it turned out okay, they have plans for legionary papillo if there is enugh interest out there.
Okay, but just how MUCH are they going to charge? And knowing Depeeka, the will decide that it really needs a big Roman eagle crest applied to the outside or something. Seriously, I cringe to think what they'd want AND what shipping would cost -- don't those things weigh about 70lbs?
Best, DMV
DECIMvS MERCATIvS VARIANvS
a.k.a.: Marsh Wise
Legio IX Hispana www.legioix.org
Alteris renumera duplum de quoquo tibi numeraverunt
" A fondness for power is implanted in most men, and it is natural to abuse it when acquired." -- Alexander Hamilton
" Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress.... But then I repeat myself." ~Mark Twain
[img size=150]http://www.romanobritain.org/Graphics/marsh_qr1.png[/img]
(Oooh, Marshall, you cannot use an icky modern QR code, it is against all policies and rules.)
A proper leather tent is something that is do-able. I have been involved in more expensive projects. I think the key here is to form a non profit eductional organization and apply for grants to fabricate the shelter and other items. Networking with schools and research institutions would be advantageous towards this end as well.<br>
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Its an idea I have not seen mentioned here and I think it is something that some of the more committed groups should try.<br>
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Sam Kimpton<br>
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Ave, Dan!<br>
<br>
Count my group (Legio VI Victrix PF) as "seriously interested" in both a Centurion's tent and a regular papilio. Any idea of what the price will be?<br>
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T. Flavius Crispus<br>
Legio VI Victrix Pia Fidelis<br>
California, USA <p></p><i></i>
T. Flavius Crispus / David S. Michaels
Centurio Pilus Prior,
Legio VI VPF
CA, USA
"Oderint dum probent."
Tiberius
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Flavius, No idea yet. This first one was part of a "deal", but I will get prices soon.<br>
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Dan <p></p><i></i>
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