negro helmet in plastic vases ? help me please

[drreham]

[attachment=6489]1.jpg[/attachment]
hi all
i have found some picture about greek negro vases in helleinc art i found one of them the negro wear something may be a helmet but in a strange shape it decorative with flowers if any one saw this helmet before or have any opinion about this vase please tell me , i want also to ask about another vase the negro wear a criss cross diadem but i don,t know why he wear it and who wear this diadem in general ?

thanks
i will attach two photo

[foojer]

looks a bit like a Persian tiara, maybe it's meant to depict an African in Persian service?

[Macedon]

These are two different items though. The one on the top wears indeed something like a Scythian cap, whereas the other one has some bands on his head, I wouldn't say that the stomion, the upper part of the cup depicts some kind of hat. Interesting items, do you have more information on these? Like where they are kept, where they were found? Maybe some colored images? The one with the Scythian cap might even not depict a negro. A higher resolution image and one from a different angle would help there.

edit : I found a better image that confirms to my mind that it is a negro in the first image



Beautiful...

[drreham]

i know some imformation not more about them , they belongs to 4th century bc and may be south italy manfacture , the first i don,t know the found place but the second found in Vulici but i don,t agree with you that the first not depict negro , i think his face has all Anatomical features for negro , and agree with you the first look like Scythian cap but why negro wear this , i notice also the second his eyes looks above as if conversing god , Unfortunately i haven,t any pictures also for this vases .

thanks for picture it is very Beautiful , can i ask you from were you get it

[Macedon]

see edit in the first post. Anatomy sometimes can be misleading in Greek pottery. Masks used in Greek drama bore sometimes much resemblance to what we would call black African characteristics but they were only caricatures of faces and had nothing to do with racial determination. In low res images and from unfavorable angles, sometimes it is very difficult to tell. It is not that much the nose and certainly not the color but mainly the hair in this image that points to the person depicted being a black African.

I found it in a random, silly site about black Africans appearing in Greek pottery -I just image googled and saw it- but the link points to it being someplace in wikicommons, so probably it is also used in some wikipedia article.

[KrimzonKnight]

I have always wondered about the presence of negroes in ancient greece, ever since I saw this in a museum in san antonio. What would the status of a negro be in ancient greece? would they have been second class citizens or could they live normally like any greek?