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Moi Watson
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, Merlot in one hand, Cigar in the other; body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming "WOO HOO, what a ride!
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That is a very sad case indeed but then Archaeological Vandalism goes on everywhere even here in Britain I have come across loads of it by Archaeologists.
Brian Stobbs
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That is very sad. One of the reasons why Historical stuff is barely funded here is because the only interest most people have is in selling the artifacts really, and the Historians can't stop them often times, let alone get any real information about how and where the artifact was found.
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A problem with the US way of thinking about ownership of land.
The comments show it pretty well. Even the comments that condemn the looting see it as a theft against the owner of the land... not as theft against the state or the US people.
Here in Denmark anything found in the ground belong to the state. Actually bin like that since 1241 where Jyske lov say that what don't belong to anyone belong to the king. The person who finds stuff like coins and other more valuable stuff will get the value of the metal and a bonus based on its historical significance. (about something = to 2-300000 USD is paid in this way each year)
If I want to build a house, the project have to be approved by the local museum first, so if there is anything of important it can be excavated first.
(the problem with this off cause is that something like 90% of all excavations are done like this, to save what can be saved before somebody builds a house... so rather few excavations are done purely as research)
Thomas Aagaard
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It's alarming to hear that treasure hunts are organized on this scale and publicly at that. But the laws about ownership of the land and what's beneath it meet with some resistance here as well; that kind of thought is not a USA monopoly. Whenever I tell my students that they cannot keep ancient artifacts, even if they come up in their own garden, they are usually quite astonished. The idea that the state could claim something from their ground needs to be explained. Adults are no better - the most famous story from my home country is that of the large Mosaic of Vichten (over 60 m2, showing Homer and the Nine Muses). It was discovered by a farmer building a new barn, and there was a lot of trouble to get him to let them excavate it, and get it to the museum (afaik, he was about to sell it, however illegally).
M. Caecilius M.f. Maxentius - Max C.
Qui vincit non est victor nisi victus fatetur
- Q. Ennius, Annales, Frag. XXXI, 493
Secretary of the Ricciacus Frënn (
http://www.ricciacus.lu/)
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Quote:A problem with the US way of thinking about ownership of land.
It's the difference between modern socialism and modern capitalism. Generally, the mineral rights (oil, gold, anything valuable) are transferred to the new owner of a property in the US. Much of that is changing rapidly, though, so be patient, Thomas. Soon our government will own the relics, just as yours does where you are.
M. Demetrius Abicio
(David Wills)
Saepe veritas est dura.
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It was very interesting (and somewhat dismaying) to read through the comments attached to the NYT piece, rather than the article itself.
I was amazed by the attitude of quite a number of the replies posted on the NYT website. There was a definite current of anti-educational attitude there - an attitude that is becoming all too common over here in the UK as well. A number of people were also much more concerned about the 'rights' of property owners to dispose of things found on their own land than they were about the rights of society as a whole to its history. There was even a case of proposed legislation which was allowed quietly to drop because of the vociferous objections from the very groups who engage in these activities. I can see that there would be absolutely no chance of something like the Portable Antiquities Scheme (PAS) to come into force in America - much less the more stringent version that applies in Scotland. In only a few cases was there a realisation that the context of an artefact was at least as important, if not more so, than the artefact itself.
It's very dispiriting to see such ignorance displayed by people from a modern Western state, as evidenced from the posts made on the NYT website. But maybe we should not crow too much. I, personally, know of a case where a farmer found a Roman wall on his property and promptly bulldozed the lot because under no circumstances was he willing to have the site excavated. Even within Caerleon, inside the fortress itself, there was a case in the 1950s where some houses were being constructed in a large garden of another house, and the whole thing was ploughed up so that there would be no question of any archaeological dig, which would have led to a delay in construction.
Whether you like it or not, TV programmes such as 'Time Team' have done us a great service by making the public here in the UK much more aware of what archaeology means and how it is carried out. I mourn its passing almost as much as I rejoice that I will no longer have to listen to Tony Robinson talking about "geo-fizz"!
Mike Thomas
(Caratacus)
visne scire quod credam? credo orbes volantes exstare.
