Squamata backing: leather or linen?

[Franklin]

Any consensus here? Those of you out there who do sport scale shirts, what is yours backed with?

[TITVS SABATINVS AQVILIVS]

I've made my squamata on heavyand semi-rigid leather: it works great! Almost aeternal. While a friend of mine have to repair his linen based squamata very frequently and now, after about four years of use, he must to make a totally new one...

Vale,

[Franklin]

I've made my squamata on heavyand semi-rigid leather: it works great! Almost aeternal. While a friend of mine have to repair his linen based squamata very frequently and now, after about four years of use, he must to make a totally new one...

Vale,

Really? What's your idea of semi-rigid? Any clue what weight leather you're using?

Seems like it would kind of negate the biggest advantage of squamata (flexibility).

Also, any pictures by chance!?

[Franklin]

Also (open for discussion) what is the evidence for either/both?

[Celer]

Salve,

There is a surviving scale shoulder piece from a C5th BC Scythian grave in the Crimea. It is currently in storage at the Ashmolean Museum in Oxford. The scales are bronze and are sewn onto a heavy leather backing.

Hope this helps.

Vale,

Celer.

[Franklin]

Thanks!

[Peroni]

I used thick linen canvas on my cuirass. It allows the shirt to'breathe'. Leather just makes you sweat buckets! It's also a great deal easier to tailor, apply scales and generally maintain than leather.

Seems like it would kind of negate the biggest advantage of squamata (flexibility).

Scale is only flexible in the vertical plane. It doesn't flex horizontally because the scales are wired together, and applied to the backing that way.

If you'd like to see how I constructed mine, send me a PM and I'll forward the .pdf file to you.

[LUCIUS ALFENUS AVITIANUS]

I have a squamata, too.

I have made mine as Peroni, using a canvas linen backing. Regarding flexibility, the first time you put a squamata are very rigid, and time after time it adapts to your body.

I haven't had problems of break the backing, as suggest by Sabatinus. My lorica have more than 4 years old.

[madoc]

My squamata is maybe 6 years old and I used a layer of rough silk and rough linen as backing. Never had an issue.

Very flexible, doesn't make you sweat either.

I have 5mm mail with doubling and 18g lorica and I always end up wearing the scale.

[Franklin]

I ordered a load of scales from Deepeeka and initially sewed them onto a cotton canvas backing. Now I've taken the hauberk down to bits again. Wanted to sew them onto a more period backing, and also change my design a bit.

That's me in the middle. It's an SCA photograph, so please be gentle with the (many) glaring mistakes present. The gent next to me is wearing plastic (yes, I said plastic) lamellar for Christ sake!

[Robert Vermaat]

I second Adrian's and Cesar's experiences, although I used hemp canvas. Sturdy stuff anyway. No problems at all. I would not use leather either - it can become very unpleasant and wet.

Franklin, for SCA you look just fine. What's this guy next to you wearing on his elbow?????

[Franklin]

What's this guy next to you wearing on his elbow?????

"Sport armor" I guess is the best way to describe it. SCA combat requires full protection of knees, elbows, wrist, groin, kidney, neck, and face. This was more of a dress occassion, but apparently he had on some of his sport fighting gear.

[Robert Vermaat]

This was more of a dress occassion

Yeah, I noticed the lack of bars before your faces! What kingdom do you belong to? Do you have a Late Roman unit?

I like that tiny hand just showing in the hand of the guy behind you..

Shall we set up a separate SCA thread?

[Franklin]

His daughter was about three when this photo was taken. Wanted to march with daddy in the procession! Couldn't be more precious if she tried.

These are from the Kingdom of Meridies, or the Southeast United States (Georgia, Alabama, Tennessee, excluding Florida). I've since moved to Washington, DC, and once I'm on my feet may join up with Matt Amt and Leg XX for some more serious reenacting.

We don't have any organized contingent per se, but there does seem to be a huge concentration of Late Roman folks in that area. Especially odd when you consider that the SCA "period" spans about 1500 years from Christ to the New World.

Actually, I've considered starting a dedicated thread on RAT a number of times. I think there are probably lots of SCA folks just like me who are interested in making the jump to more authentic kit, etc.

I studied in the UK while I was at Uni and had the pleasure of training and playing with The Vikings (couldn't find any Roman groups nearby). There seems to be a lot of tension between SCA folks and "serious reenactors" but what struck me was how completely similar the two were! Lots of computer geeks, ex-military guys, history nerds, table-top gamers, theatre-types.

I even wrote a whole dissertation on the phenomenon of Historical Reenactment groups in the UK. Fascinating read. I'm happy to email it to anybody who's interested.