making an aspis

[Giannis K. Hoplite]

It is fair to answer what I don't see as accurate in the H.A. shields and what needs improvements.
First to point out that I have handled none of the two types.
Mark,you spoke about the deep bowl,and I have read in the HA site that they favour it. However,it's inaccurate in shape,in many(if not most) of the shields I have seen. Even the deep bowls we see in vases(and ONLY in vases,not in wall paintings or sculptures,and not in all vases either) have a different shape. The so deep bowls just don't seem right.they may be convinient to rest them on the showlder,but in the pressure of the battle I don't know how handy they'd be.
Second,the rims in most of them are also inaccurate,in size,shape and angles.Not all of their shields are the same,I know,and some are quite right in shape. Also,the slot that follows the rim and the sircomference of the bowl in not existant in all of them.
The waight.Your shields are about 14 lb. This means about 6,4 kg. And they are not faced with bronze,nor with bronze rims. I remind that manning shields are 4,3 kg. Far less than the H.A. and they became about 8 kgs with the brass facing,mostly because the brass needed to be thinner.And even with this, 8 kg is not out of the estimate many ascholars have suggested.
The construction.I have noted that most H.A. shields are made by triangular planks curved and joined in the center. I have not seen this,not even indicated,ina ny vase,sculpture,ancient term or original find. In contrast,manning make them from planks and turned in a lathe. Planks is the one and only original find we have and is backed up by Aristophanes. Lathe is also backed up by Aristophanes. The Chigi vase is the only one that indicates another construction,but even this can be interpreted in a hundred different opinions,like smaller planks of wood,paint on the interior,small parts of leather to cover the back etc etc.
Fittings. Manning offers a viriety of internal fittings,that are as accurate as it can get. They've made the actual porpax from the Vatican shield,they've made porpax from late vase paintings,they've made the archaic one. And also the rest of the fittings,the rings etc are the most accurate. Even the way they are kept in place,with the long thin bronze nails is the correct one.
Strenght.Are you suggesting that re-enacting needs more heavy constuctions than the real things that were designed for battle? Because even if the Vatican shield is Etruscan and not Greek(that is not much of a poin anyway) it was constructed for battle,and manning akes them based on tha shield,with the same matterials and the same constuction methods.
Shape.Many full covered aspises do not come from the archaic but from the early,middle and even late clasical periods(the Vatican shield among them).All have overall the same shape,no deeper than manning make or anything. So why suppose that they must have had deeper ones?
I agree there may have been many ways of construction,evidence for wich we don't have yet. In contrast,we have the bronze facings of many shield and we have the a single one with the wood almost intact. Why regect this consttuction in favour of another one? I could speculate that some hoplite helmets were made from leather.No one can proove the oposite,but if you're going to buy or make one,will you prefer leather?
At last,even the HA in their site have admitted that their shields are not very satisfactory and they're looking to find better with no big cost. Why deny this?
For all the above reasons I say to Lochinvar,from the two,I'd suggest the manning ones.The cost I don't know,you have to compare and I know that for everything manning makes you have to pay a lot.
To Mark,of course I don't mean to offend anybody,I just wanted to give a fair picture of what is out there. H.A. continues to be one of the most accurate groups,but this doesn't mean that they don't need improvement,or some thing are better from other sources.
Khairete
Giannis

PS. Lochinvar,those long discussions for every bit of detail may become frustrating some times,when you need a clear aswer,but they offer you the ability to decide yourself,and make the best movement.