Carrus and Carroballista

[P. Clodius Secundus]

At the PompeiiReborn event in Alabama one of the other legions (Rusty's sixth?) had brought along a small two-wheeled cart to haul baggage and firewood. I started researching to build one for III Cyranaica and once I looked at the carroballistae on Trajan's Column the project spiraled (pun intended) out of control. Three months later I am getting ready to put the finishing touches on my first foray into the art of the ancient wainwright/cartwright, a full-sized reconstruction of a two-mule army cart. I know there are a number of chariots out there, but has anyone else tried making just a basic baggage carrus? If so how'd it turn out? I'm looking for ideas for the remaining details, especially the tack and harness. The 8-spoke spindle turned wheels are based on Trajan's. I just picked up the 46" iron rim bands today. The closed planking sides are from Trajan's and Marcus Aurelieus. The HBO series Rome had some great open-sided carts with an X motif, but I had to go with the two best images I could find that are known to be military issue. The hub shape and lion's head axle caps are referenced to Roring's reconstructions. Does anyone have an iron framed ballista and a pair of mules handy? I really want to see the original light artillery concept in action behind a shield wall. I await your suggestions and or comments.

[Marcus Julius]

Does anyone have an iron framed ballista and a pair of mules handy? I really want to see the original light artillery concept in action behind a shield wall. I await your suggestions and or comments.

I've got two trained teams at my disposal, and another team not broke at all (one was just born 3weeks ago), but they're here in MT with me.

[P. Clodius Secundus]

Marcus,
Sounds like you're a bit too far away. I'll have to make-do with calones or a two-barbarian hitch. It's just that they're so hard to keep groomed. I found an old bit at a local junk shop that I plan to leave draped over the trace pole or cross bar. I believe it's called a fixed 2-slotted pelham or curb bit. Does it look like something they would have used, and if so how would the reins and straps go?

[P. Clodius Secundus]

In case anyone is interested, here's an after-action review on the performance of the combined Legio III/Legio XXIV Carroballista at Roman Days in Maryland this past weekend.
Thursday 5/31/07 the cart was transported south from MA to MD courtesy of LaWren's Nest. (Thanks Lawrence and Julie) and assembled on site. We were unable to get a mule team to show up, but we are working with several groups to arrange live-drive field trials.
Friday 6/1/07 Gallio of Leg XXIV arrived with his wood-framed catapult. Like kids on Christmas morning we couldn't wait to put our new toy together.
Two issues became readily apparent.
1. The mono-pod style mount I had built to mount the engine was too tall.
2. The mount would need to be secured in the bed of the cart during traveling and firing.
Using the limited tools on hand we cut down the stand to a more reachable and stable height and secured it to the bed with long screws. (Purists, don't get your sub ubi in a bunch. A period correct solution is in the works.). Since there were no mules hitched to stabilize the cart we substituted hay bales. Another anachronism, but crudely effective. We proceeded to fire a number of rounds of multiple types of ammunition (large arrow, bolt, and SCA) with no apparent loss of range or accuracy. In some respects the engine seemed easier to handle due to the winch being at waist level and the trigger at chest level with the "muzzle" elevated. Our experiment ended when the temporary wooden pintle on the base broke. We transferred the weapon to it's normal ground mount for the rest of the day. Unfortunately Sunday's rains prevented us from trying again with a new metal shaft installed. Despite the limited test and teething troubles, I feel confident making a few preliminary observations;
1. There is no apparent reason why an iron-framed engine is necessary. A properly made and balanced cart could easily handle a wood-framed catapult.
2. The short mono-pod firing bases depicted on Trajan's are not just a matter of perspective. For stability and access they really are shorter. This also explains why they are shown elevated on pedestals of cribbing when dismounted.
3. Cutting the rear of the bedsides off at an angle as seen on the Column of Marcus Aureliius would allow greater traverse and easier access when the engine is elevated to firing angle.
Areas for future development are;
1. A sturdier base with an iron pintle and a wider top to improve stability and durability.
2. A period-possible method of attaching and dismounting the base.
3. Some method of securing the stock of the weapon during travel and cocking. (similar to the travel-lock on modern tanks and SP guns)
4. Installation of ammo storage baskets or quivers in the bed.
5. Developing some form of range lines of stops.
If you have any suggestions or ideas in these areas I look forward to hearing them. Photos of the event, including shots of Leg IIIs "Atomic Cannon" ballista and onager in action are posted in the Events Forum.

[Dan Z]

You did an excellent job on the carrus - sort of the Duece-and-a-half of the Roman army - and the LegioIII/LegioXXIV carroballista was an impressive sight!

Next Roman Days I will be sure to bring along some hand tools - they aren't period, but they will definitely make performing field modifications and repairs much easier!

[D B Campbell]

Photos of the event, including shots of Leg IIIs "Atomic Cannon" ballista and onager in action are posted in the Events Forum.

Any photos of your carroballista?

[P. Clodius Secundus]

Here's the best shot I've seen posted so far (cr. Deb Fuller) I'm hoping some one else posts some shots of it in action. Gallio and I were too busy experimenting to bother with a camera. The broken pintle and Sunday's rain prevented me from taking any. Luckily Legio XXIV is only over in the next province and we get together often. I'm still working on getting some mules and assembling workable tack. Some day I hope to get all three components, Mules, cart, and catapult together and conduct live-fire testing like the tank gunnery ranges I used to run.

[D B Campbell]

Here's the best shot I've seen posted so far (cr. Deb Fuller).

Nice! What size of "ballista" are you using in the cart?

(btw Is that a baby Schramm-type onager in the background? )

[P. Clodius Secundus]

I'm not sure of the rating of Gallio's (George Metz's) engine. It is probably best classified as a catapulta since it is a bolt shooter. It's larger than what I'd consider a "scorpion". He's got a very good section about it on his LEG XXIV website. One of our new guys is a huge archery buff. He's working on a scorpion which we plan on using for some field tests when it is fininshed. He has sent me a few early-build photos, and I've seen his work on bows and arrows. I anticipate he'll wind up with a sweet little engine-o-death. His woodworking is terrific, but he's condsidering painting it anyways. I haven't seen that done but considering the investment in time and effort making them and the Roman penchant for what we'd consider gaudy color schemes he may be right. I thought some folks might chide me about the Barnum & Bailey look of my cart wheels, but if anything most have said that I should paint the body as well. Perhaps a nice bright vermillion... Like Robin Williams said in Good Morning Vietman, "If you're going to fight, clash!". The onger in the background is Fred Wojic's. I don't know what he used for source material for the build. I'm still waiting for some more folks to post pictures from the arty demo. Fred hasn't had time to work the kinks out of his "Atomic Cannon". Even so it's impressive to behold. I'm working on an A-frame/Tripod that we need to lift the torsion frames into place.

[P. Clodius Secundus]

Calling all ballistriarii... now that I have the carrus pretty much sorted out (well, except for cutting about a foot off of the bed length and angling the rear corners) and the prototype of the base is built, I'm working on the design for the last two major components and I'm looking for opinions and ideas. First is a rectangular box with curved, presumably rope, handles on each end to support the front of the base when the ballista is being transported. The only evidence or image of this limber chest is from Trajan's scene of the large ballista being transported in the cart. The foot of the base is supported on something and since AFAIK the mule carts were led rather rather than ridden, there was no bench seat in the front. I am leaning towards making a wooden framed wicker sided box with rope handles and a wooden top. Practical experience has shown that such a chest would be handy for hauling spanners and spares. The final piece of the puzzle is of course the weapon itself. I've pretty much settled on a design which I'm going to call the "Noisy Cricket".
It's an iron-framed in-swinger with 79mm washers, a double round-ratchet winch. In the drawing I show it with a thin section of the case projecting forward of the frame to support the slider. Currently I am leaning towards dropping this in favor of a fixed but removable slider with a sliding claw/trigger block. This would allow me to quickly switch between an arrow-grooved two-claw setup and a wider stone-grooved single claw rig. Swap out the bow string and you've got a true dual purpose ballista. There's scant evidence to support this idea, but it's just too cool not to try it out :twisted: I would help explain the name change from catapult to ballista and also why they were apparently transported without the slider installed. They didn't yet know what type of target they'd be engaging. I await your suggestions and comments.

[D B Campbell]

It would help explain ... why they were apparently transported without the slider installed.

I don't think I've ever heard this theory. Where did you get it from, Randi?

[M. Demetrius]

That is so cool. I've envisioned just making a smaller cart to haul stuff, maybe like yours only scaled down to about 2/3 size. There are a bazillion uses for something like that at any camp or event.

So spill the beans, if you please:
how did you make it so it comes apart for travelling?
what kind of bearings did you use for the axle?
Is the tongue removable, too? Does it fit in a metal sleeve?

More and more interested as time goes on. Just acquired about 20 hardwood chair spindles for wheel spokes. Free. Free is good.

[P. Clodius Secundus]

It would help explain ... why they were apparently transported without the slider installed.

I don't think I've ever heard this theory. Where did you get it from, Randi?

Like most of my ideas I pulled it out of what we old tankers refer to as our fourth point of contact :lol: ... Seriously, there are two in transport images that I relied upon heavily to come up with my interpretation of the carroballista base. The one from Marcus Aurelius that you used in G&R Artillery. In that one I see the side view of the base and case of a ballista. The field frames, arms, slider, and winch levers/handles are missing. Perhaps they were raised metal details such as were originally on Trajan's. Their absence proves nothing, but this view does indicate that they were transported with the base in the fully forward position This becomes important later. The other image, from Trajan's this time, veiwed in context of the scene seems to show a 3/4 frontal view. Again the base is fully forward in the cart bed. The entire forward column is visible, possibly resting on a shelf or a limber chest as I propose. The frames are there but no arms, slider, or projection of the case are visible beyond the lower ladder. Here too they may have been long lost metallic details. To argue that they really were way out there when the engine was at rest might get you branded as an in-swinger heretic. The only other evidence I can point to is the ground-mounted ballista on the wooden cribbing. The frame is angled forward as if depressed, yet the slider is angled upwards. To me this suggests that they might be installing it. Like I said, it's only a circumstantial case but the concept of interchangeable sliders /slings for sharps and stones is too interesting not to pursue I intend to see where it leads.

[P. Clodius Secundus]

That is so cool. I've envisioned just making a smaller cart to haul stuff, maybe like yours only scaled down to about 2/3 size. There are a bazillion uses for something like that at any camp or event.

So spill the beans, if you please:
how did you make it so it comes apart for travelling?
what kind of bearings did you use for the axle?
Is the tongue removable, too? Does it fit in a metal sleeve?

More and more interested as time goes on. Just acquired about 20 hardwood chair spindles for wheel spokes. Free. Free is good.

A 2/3 size cart would be much handier about camp. I actually screwed up and made this one about a foot too long. Chalk it up to those lessons learned, but this winter I plan to cut off the excess and rebuild it. The axle is held in place by four wooden dowel pegs into the bottom side rails. This allows me to move the axle fore and aft. By serendipity I drilled one set of holes at the perfect balance point and the cart has stood for over half an hour on its two wheels alone. The center of the axle is lashed with rope to the center rail and the end of the trace pole is in turn lashed to that. It's not as sturdy as the real thing I suspect, but they didn't have to tow theirs on a trailer behind a Hyundai. To transport it I slide the bed off onto a 4x8 trailer, pull the lynch pins on the hubs, and stow the wheels, pole, and axle in the bed. The bearing surfaces are copper tubing (they used bronze) on an iron axle. The spokes are spindle turned railing stiles from home depot. Chair spindles will work just fine as well. I took progress photos of the entier process I'll try to post them if you're interested.

[M. Demetrius]

Absolutely interested. I'm sure a lot of other people would also be.

I'd pay for a set of dimensional plans, and I'll bet I'm not alone there. The details like how you hold the axle in place, but make it movable for different loads, for example would be worth the price of the plans all by itself. (well, don't go crazy with the price... :lol: )

Not being a natural born carter, I'd have to think a long time to come up with the ideas you've already had, make mistakes you've already corrected, etc. Does the iron axle fit fairly snugly in the copper tube, and do you pump it with grease? (I admit, I've considered the front axle bearing from an old bicycle, concealed in a wood block. Don't kill me.)