Later Period Spathas design and construction

[Firmus4474]

For some time now I've been searching for solid information and, images of latter period spathas. For some reason the 5th. century seems to be a big gap and, information is hard to come by.
Now that I have come up with a little I thought I'd post it for others who may be trying to answer my old "are there any 5th. cen. swords not covered in gold?" questions.

Most of this is my own guess work and, I not only welcome more informed opinions I would be most greatful to anyone who lets me know what I've got wrong.

From what I can tell for the most part there are two basic types. I have no idea if they have proper names already but I call them the Krefeld and, Horn types.

I'll start with my Krefeld type.
I consider it the more Roman due to the fact that the two swords I know of that have partial hilts( Krefeld-Gelep gr.43 and, Feltwell) seem to follow the tradition of wood guard, ivory or, bone grip and, wood pommel/upper guard.
The scabbard fittings are also very simmilar in the Krefeld sword and, the sword from Petersfinger gr.21. The Feltwells are somewhat different in decoration but, basic shape is the same.

I'll start with that and, this drawing. Am I anywhere near the mark?

[Robert Vermaat]

Objects from warrior grave 21 from Petersfinger:
http://www.fectio.org.uk/articles/hwb/33.jpg

It is considered Roman, but the distribution map shows it has strong Germanic connections, too:

Distribution map of Late Roman swords of the types Brighthampton and Krefeld-Gellep/Samson/Abingdon:

[Firmus4474]

Cool, thank you for the map. It seems the Krefeld-Gellep type finds are mostly from the Rhine and, Danube frontiers and, the Brighthampton (that I bet is what I've been calling "horn" due to the fact that the few I've seen had horn hilts :roll: ok. somtimes I'm not that creative.)
are from farther north and, east.
So, my two basic types guess was right.


:It is considered Roman, but the distribution map shows it has strong Germanic connections, too:

That makes sense at this point in history. My guess the style was made in Roman workshops and, also used as a model by Germanic smiths as well.
I've also haven't found any with metal guard plates as seen on later swords from the 6th. century (not that I've seen pictures of many).

The one thing I do wonder about is the pommel caps. Petersfinger 21 has one Krefeld-gellep and, Feltwell none was found. I wonder if that may have anything to do with who manufactured the hilts. That is to say pommel caps are a Germanic addition to the basic Roman type?

[Firmus4474]

Here is the feltwell, the scabbard throat differs from the Petersfinger and, Krefeld swords in that is punched dots instead of the more linear patterns on the others.
At the moment I think the Feltwell still fits with the Krefeld group, as the Brighthampton type scabbard mounts seem to be decorated with filagree and inlay work.

I also expect to find that the Brighthampton type is more likley to have a fullered blade than the Krefeld type. But, I don't have enough information to be sure.

[Firmus4474]

Okay nobody has shot any of my ideas down yet. Here is a picture of a Krefeld-Gellep type chape. This one is from Abingdon but, the one from Krefeld-Gellep grave 43 is pretty much identical.
Also a couple of Brighthampton hilts.
They seem to come from mostly outside the Roman world and, haven't seen one with a pommel cap yet so, there may go my pommel caps are a Germanic addition idea.

[Paulus Claudius Damianus]

Very interesting!

[Firmus4474]

Thank you Paulus, information on spathas from this period have been the main stumbling block for me in creating a 5th century kit.
I had feared that I would post my guess work and, it would all turn out to be wrong :oops: .
As soon as I gather enough information I will post measurements and, blade profiles.

[brennivs - tony drake]

Firmvs just a thought the gold covered hilts would probley be copy of more perishable hilts if it wasnt for the gold they too shape wise would have been lost.If you look at the early Gladivs hilts covered in silver they are copys of there wooden cousins it may be worth thinking about D

[Firmus4474]

Hello Brennivs,

That's what I've often thought about the gold hilted swords. And, as you mentioned there is evedence for this from earlier periods.
Looking at the grip of the Feltwell sword one can see that it has the same basic shape as the gold hilts. The Blucina sword for one seems to have a Krefeld type chape as does the sword from Gultlingen.

The Feltwell has me a little stumped, it almost dosen't fit in with the Krefeld type and, has no place with the Brighthampton type.

Looking forward to any info you can find . A little off topic but, think I may have come up with a way to make one of those complicated bosses of the period as well.

Good hunting, Dave

[StephenCurtin]

Hey everyone, time to resurrect an old topic with a quick question. What exactly defines and differenciates these brighthampton and krefeld type hilts. As far as I can tell they have the same general shape, and only seem to differ in the materials that they are made from. Is this right at all or am I missing something?