Swastikas, Roman Gear, modern reenactment (cont from market)

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

You couldn't be in the Nazi Party and be in the German military

wrong, you could.

you couldnt during the Weimar republic, before Hitler became supreme chancellor (Reichskanzler) and Nazified the German state.

These days swastikas are portrayed in Germany in musea, on television, and even at re-enactments, because they comprise historical exhibition. (Historische darstellung). as long as its purpouse is educational, there is no problem.

what still is forbidden, also at re-enactments (and rightly so in my opinion) are the SS runes. The swastika and other German regalia/symbols and markings fall directly under the paragraph 68 anti-Nazi law.

The problem being the Allgemeine SS and its IVbIV branches, and sonderstaffeln.

Waffen-SS is a slightly more difficult matter, since they wore the SS runes, joined in several war crimes (just like Wehrmacht and Falschirmjaeger divisions) but were not solely there to kill Jews, Gypsies and whoever didnt fit in Nazi society. also, during the end of the war, you had Sikh waffen-SS, Turkish waffen-SS, Iranian waffen-SS, tadzjiki waffen-SS and you can hardly call those people RassenRein (of clear Aryan race) ....

however due to the fact the runes were used by such a great and murderous terror organisation, they usually invoke more anger and problems than the swastika.

Also, the Roman style swastika has naught to do with the German Nazi swastika.

The German swastika is inverted and turned up, the Roman swastika, like the Bhuddist swastika is not.





therefore there is a major difference.


M.VIB.M.

(PS nice sword Marsh!)

btw... if i would climb the temple mound in Jerusalem in full legionary kit, or Masada, id also be in trouble....... and not from the sun......

[caiusbeerquitius]

the Roman swastika, like the Bhuddist swastika is not.

This is not right, either. In Roman context both versions exist.

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

show us a Roman tilted swastika! please!

LoL

[Caballo]

Caius is right- see the Simon James Dura-Europos book "The choice of swastika motifs is not itself startling as baldric mounts and brooches with this pattern (rotating either way) are attested at Dura" (page 60).

Interestingly, he feels that the swastika on the tunic may be a symbol of rank.

Cheers

Caballo

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

i believe you!

M.VIB.M.

[hoplite14gr]

A surviving throwing disc in Olympia date to Roman age has both types on it and pottery shows both type again on disks and hoplite shields.
I do not believe ancients had "right or left turned" issue with the decoration.

Kind regards

[Robert Vermaat]

Greek helmet with swastika marks (wikipedia: 350-325 BC from Taranto, found at Herculanum. Cabinet des Médailles, Paris.):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... astika.jpg

Iranian necklace (wkipedia: Kaluraz, Guilan, first millennium BC, National Museum of Iran):


Roman mosaic with a swastica:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/e ... astika.jpg

swastika on a comb from a Danish bog, c. 300AD:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ydam.8.jpg

swastika brooches, alamannic or Bavarian, c. 600 AD:


Medieval Catholic priest:

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

there is also a relief in Connelly's Greece and rome showing symetrical motiffs on a linen Linothorax, one on either side of the chest.

[Robert Vermaat]

[Theodosius the Great]

Check it out...

1941, and this is not a German plane if you look closely.



But the swastika was quickly banned by the US military after the country finally entered the war.

~Theo

[MARCvSVIBIvSMAvRINvS]

LOL actually this plane was intended for the Finnish market i believe...

i dont know for sure wether this was an official USAAF sqn sign..........

am a USAAF re-enactor...... but there is so much to learn!

M.VIB.M.

[Theodosius the Great]

Actually, there was no US Air Force back then. That's a post-war creation. :wink: In WWII the Army and Navy had their own planes.

~Theo

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Possibly belonged to the gaurd unit Caius was on about?

[Primvs Pavlvs]

Gauis I seriously doubt that since the 45th was just a National Guard unit at that time, and infantry only as far as I know.

I will assume that this symbol is being used only as a indentifier of this individual. Bi-planes were only being used in small numbers by WW2, and usually only for spotter planes.

Theo if you notice he said USAAF, this stands for United States Army Air Force :wink:

[M. CVRIVS ALEXANDER]

Go to maps.google.com and check out Bougainville Rd, San Diego, CA 92155. Click on the satellite view.