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Hanwei Pugio
#1
hi. has anyone here handled the hanwei pugio? it is really nice looking. trying to find out how functional it is.<br>
<img src="http://kinkycamgurl.com/chenpugio.jpg" style="border:0;"/> <p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub45.ezboard.com/bromanarmytalk.showUserPublicProfile?gid=rproulx>RProulx</A> at: 2/1/04 4:19 am<br></i>
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#2
I can help rethe design, but haven't handled one- and would be very interested in comments.<br>
The design is based on the Oberammergau pugio, and the scabbard looks good. The blade is less good, with the two vertical grooves that seem made up without any archeological background that I'm aware of. Not cheap though! <p></p><i></i>
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#3
Yes, I have a couple of samples. I told Paul to take the grooves out, but he didn't listen. He saw this on daggers used by the ESG and others who made grooves to simulate the raised medial ridge and added them here for no reason. Despite the latest information, he also made a chinese copy of the indian trooper helmet!!!. It is a shame. They have the equipment and skill to make fantastic stuff, but an inability to simply copy somehting accurately, or believe that a 'trooper' helmet is as desirable as an authentic Imperial Gallic, which they could do just as easily. Other than the grooves, though, I think it is a nice piece. I do not know how well the simulated silver inlay finish will hold up under living history use.<br>
<br>
Dan <p></p><i></i>
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#4
It looks rather too short and squat to me (or has it been shortened by the uploading process?). The grooves are definitely wrong for that shape of blade and are the wrong shape in any case. I am uncomfortable with the decoration on the handle as although there are examples of highly decorated handles, it does not look particularly Roman in style to me (although I am ready to be proved wrong).<br>
I do not find the decoration of the lower half of the sheath convincing: I am uncomfortable with there being a roundle which is not enclosed within its own frame, especially when there is another roundle in the second field which is enclosed in its own frame. There should also, I believe, be a rivet through the expansion (helping to hold the sheath together) or at least a decorative boss, rather than another roundle of the same type as the other two. I have yet to see an example of this type of decoration on an expansion in preference to a rivet or boss, although some are decorated nonetheless.<br>
The top half of the sheath does indeed look like a good copy of the Oberammergau sheath but I think they have assumed rather too much about the lower half, without much reference to sources. As far as the effects of living history use go, quite a few of the originals may have lost a good deal of their silver before they themselves were lost or deposited.<br>
<br>
Crispvs <p></p><i></i>
Who is called \'\'Paul\'\' by no-one other than his wife, parents and brothers. :!: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" />:!:

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.net">www.romanarmy.net
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#5
Hi,<br>
<br>
If you want to compare the Paul Chen version with the original in Mainz, here is the url www.romanhideout.com/imag...pugio2.jpg<br>
<br>
The scabbard is a pretty good copy- sure its not silver and niello, but I dread to think what the price would be if it were!<br>
<br>
Comparing it to other pugio, I suspect that the strapholders might have been decorated with a roundel of (red?) enamel, ditto the hilt.<br>
<br>
I'd love to post the actual picture to compare and contrast- can someone help a techno illiterate here?<br>
<br>
Regards<br>
<br>
Paul <p></p><i></i>
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#6
<sure its not silver and niello, but I dread to think what the price would be if it were!><br>
<br>
About 3000 Euros! See this site:www.replik-online<br>
Definately one to buy when I win the lottery!<br>
<br>
Vale<br>
<br>
Celer.<br>
<br>
<br>
<p></p><i></i>
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#7
Celer,<br>
<br>
it's 'www.replik-online.<strong><span style="text-decoration:underline">de</span></strong>' and good luck with the lottery.<br>
<br>
Uwe <p></p><i></i>
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#8
Hey Paulus, here you go!<br>
<br>
<img src="http://img13.photobucket.com/albums/v39/TlantMagnus/Mainz_RGZM_pugio2.jpg" style="border:0;"/> <p>Magnus/Matt<br>
Legio XXX "Ulpia Victrix" Coh I<br>
<br>
"Lay your hand, or thy tongue against the greatness of Rome, and feel my wrath." - Matt Lanteigne<br>
<br>
- Number of posts: current +1248</p><i></i>
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#9
Thanks for posting the pugio pic- how did you do this?<br>
<br>
And I drooled over the pugios at replik-online.de - and winced at the price! <p></p><i></i>
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#10
Whoops! As I wipe the egg off my face I have to admit that when I went home (unfortunately I virtually never have my sources with me at work, which is where I have my internet access) and looked at a picture of the Oberammergau dagger I realised that my memory had served me very badly. I feel somewhat embarrassed that I had forgotten that the number 4 field often departs from the rules followed by the top three fields of decoration.<br>
I remain to be convinced however, of the validity of the terminal decoration on the Hanwei reconstruction. I still say that there should be a rivet or decorative boss resembling a rivet in this position.<br>
I can't think of any evidence for red enamel over the rivets securing the suspension rings, but I'm beginning to feel paranoid and wonder if I should go home and take another look at all of the articles and photos (and Obman's book) which I've collected over the years before I say anything more about pugiones.<br>
<br>
Crispvs<br>
<p></p><i></i>
Who is called \'\'Paul\'\' by no-one other than his wife, parents and brothers. :!: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" />:!:

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.net">www.romanarmy.net
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#11
"I can't think of any evidence for red enamel over the rivets securing the suspension rings" I have a picture of another pugio from Mainz where the red enamel has survived in five of the rivets securing the belt holder, and one surviving in the central part of hilt. If someone tells me how to copy this, I will! I've tried copy and control v to paste, but will it work?!? <p></p><i></i>
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#12
Please do post it if you can. I have lots of pictures of daggers and sheaths but most are line drawings. Whilst I prefer line drawings for their clarity, it does mean that I sometimes have less information than I would like about the colour and fabric of the decoration.<br>
<br>
Crispvs <p></p><i></i>
Who is called \'\'Paul\'\' by no-one other than his wife, parents and brothers. :!: <img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" />:!:

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.romanarmy.net">www.romanarmy.net
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#13
Hi,<br>
<br>
Here is the url for the enamelled dagger www.zum.de/Faecher/G/BW/L...dolch1.htm<br>
<br>
If someone could post instructions on how to post an image on RAT, I'll post these images directly and save my Roman comrades a click!<br>
<br>
Regards<br>
<br>
Paulus <p></p><i></i>
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#14
A handy place to which you can upload images and then post links is www.photobucket.com<br>
<br>
<p>Legio XX<br>
Fortius Conamur<br>
<br>
</p><i></i>
Richard Campbell
Legio XX - Alexandria, Virginia
RAT member #6?
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#15
I bought one of these pugios, and find it to be well balances, but unfortunately cannot use it for re-enactment, as it was not deemed authentic. Sad cry:

Sincerely

B. Angel
Visne partem mei capere? Comminus agamus! * Me semper rogo, Quid faceret Iulius Caesar? * Confidence is a good thing! Overconfidence is too much of a good thing.
[b]Legio XIIII GMV. (Q. Magivs)RMRS Remember Atuatuca! Vengence will be ours!
Titus Flavius Germanus
Batavian Coh I
Byron Angel
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