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The Whole North Into Gaul
Quote:Remistus was Magister Utriusque Militiae in 455-456. Ricimer and Majorian hold the title at the same time in 456-457, both appointed by Leo I. The best reconstruction, by Ian Hughes, is that Majorian was the senior Master of Soldiers and Ricimer was the junior under Avitus. They revolted against Avitus, killed Remistus, and Majorian was proclaimed emperor, and he elevated Ricimer to the senior command in 457, appointing Nepotianus as the junior Master of Soldiers that same year.

Fine. That puts him on the scene to take an Odoacer under his wing in the late 450's/early 460's.

Quote:As for the rise of Flaccitheus, I can't tell you whether or not that date of 467 is true.

Flaccitheus enters the picture shortly after having established his kingdom. IMHO that puts him in the 450's rather than the 460's as there is no reason for him not establishing a kingdom once his former overlords the Huns were off the scene, and they were off the scene soon after the battle of Nedao in 454.

Quote:Although I sincerely doubt the late 450's would be any time to get embroiled in Roman politics especially the like of Ricimer's. The late 450's was dominated by the breakup of the western half of the Hunnic empire, which would mean Edeco (the King of the Scirii at the time) and Odoacer would have been embroiled in the politics of it. Ardaric's revolt/bid for the Hunnic throne (depending on who you read), the Ostrogoths break away a couple years later in about 456/457. And Odoacer may still have been dealing with the leftovers of the situation in North Gaul after Chalons, and the rise of the Merovingian Franks.

My impression is that Odoacer had very little besides his princely title when he visited Severinus. It would be an ideal time for him to try his luck in Italy. Ricimer was establishing his power base and needed lieutenants he could rely on. Someone like Odoacer would have been perfect for his purposes - prestige of birth and military experience, but materially dependent on his benefactor.

(05-31-2016, 10:34 AM)Robert Vermaat Wrote:
(05-30-2016, 04:11 PM)Justin Swanton Wrote: ... the Franks finished the job of teaching them manners in their homeland in the ‘islands’ – possibly Holland.

That would be The Netherlands, or Zeeland if you want the province. Wink

Of course! Blush
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Messages In This Thread
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-25-2013, 03:28 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by M. Demetrius - 05-26-2013, 12:18 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by D B Campbell - 05-26-2013, 01:11 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Eleatic Guest - 05-26-2013, 03:36 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-26-2013, 05:21 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Diocle - 05-27-2013, 03:02 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-27-2013, 10:14 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-28-2013, 05:04 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Eleatic Guest - 05-28-2013, 11:23 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 05-29-2013, 04:11 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by M. Demetrius - 05-29-2013, 10:18 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-29-2013, 01:58 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by M. Demetrius - 05-29-2013, 02:16 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-29-2013, 02:36 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-30-2013, 05:41 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Diocle - 05-30-2013, 08:34 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Macedon - 05-30-2013, 08:59 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 05-31-2013, 04:26 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-22-2013, 06:28 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Lyceum - 06-23-2013, 12:17 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 07-19-2013, 05:09 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Macedon - 07-19-2013, 10:34 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 07-20-2013, 06:38 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Macedon - 07-20-2013, 07:18 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Nathan Ross - 07-20-2013, 07:33 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 07-21-2013, 12:06 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Longovicium - 07-21-2013, 01:44 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 07-21-2013, 05:37 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 07-21-2013, 08:13 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-12-2013, 06:41 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Macedon - 08-12-2013, 08:18 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-12-2013, 08:22 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by M. Demetrius - 08-12-2013, 09:10 PM
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The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-12-2013, 09:58 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Thomas V. - 08-13-2013, 12:35 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-31-2013, 12:50 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-31-2013, 10:46 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-05-2013, 02:34 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-05-2013, 07:23 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 09-06-2013, 07:20 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Alanus - 09-07-2013, 10:43 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 09-07-2013, 01:03 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Nathan Ross - 09-07-2013, 03:28 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-07-2013, 04:49 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-10-2013, 12:28 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 09-10-2013, 12:27 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-10-2013, 03:33 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-21-2013, 09:36 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-09-2013, 12:14 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-09-2013, 12:17 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-11-2013, 12:53 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 10-11-2013, 02:16 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 10-11-2013, 04:09 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-11-2013, 06:35 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-11-2013, 09:35 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-11-2013, 09:42 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-12-2013, 12:21 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-12-2013, 07:02 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-12-2013, 10:05 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-12-2013, 02:37 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-12-2013, 10:53 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-14-2013, 10:49 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 10-15-2013, 04:07 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-15-2013, 10:48 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Robert Vermaat - 10-15-2013, 01:24 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-15-2013, 08:50 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-16-2013, 04:18 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-16-2013, 05:51 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-16-2013, 08:24 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-16-2013, 08:57 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-16-2013, 09:13 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-17-2013, 12:03 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 10-17-2013, 04:20 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-17-2013, 05:02 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-20-2013, 11:01 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 10-21-2013, 03:25 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-21-2013, 10:50 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by sonic - 10-21-2013, 01:28 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-21-2013, 02:24 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 10-21-2013, 02:53 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 10-27-2013, 11:39 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 11-01-2013, 02:42 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 11-01-2013, 03:36 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Eleatic Guest - 11-02-2013, 10:56 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 11-03-2013, 02:57 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 11-03-2013, 03:58 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 11-03-2013, 04:31 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 11-26-2013, 04:29 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-09-2014, 09:13 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by jkmol - 01-09-2014, 11:03 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-09-2014, 11:28 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-10-2014, 12:07 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Michael Kerr - 01-10-2014, 03:04 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 01-10-2014, 07:49 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-10-2014, 11:49 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Athena Areias - 01-10-2014, 12:08 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-10-2014, 04:03 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-10-2014, 09:09 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 01:15 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Epictetus - 01-11-2014, 03:55 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Eleatic Guest - 01-11-2014, 03:58 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Thomas V. - 01-11-2014, 08:33 AM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by D B Campbell - 01-11-2014, 01:11 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 01:18 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 01-11-2014, 01:48 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 02:26 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Thomas V. - 01-11-2014, 02:48 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Thomas V. - 01-11-2014, 02:49 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 03:01 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Thomas V. - 01-11-2014, 03:26 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 03:35 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 04:31 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 01-11-2014, 05:44 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 06:21 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 08:38 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 01-11-2014, 10:11 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 10:16 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Renatus - 01-11-2014, 10:29 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-11-2014, 10:33 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-12-2014, 02:40 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-12-2014, 09:16 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-12-2014, 10:13 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-13-2014, 12:03 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-13-2014, 12:11 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-15-2014, 01:01 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Renatus - 01-15-2014, 12:33 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-15-2014, 01:09 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Renatus - 01-15-2014, 10:14 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-15-2014, 11:03 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Tim - 01-15-2014, 11:20 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-15-2014, 11:30 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Tim - 01-16-2014, 03:44 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-16-2014, 11:28 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-17-2014, 12:39 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-18-2014, 03:16 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Renatus - 01-18-2014, 03:34 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-18-2014, 04:32 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-18-2014, 10:18 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-18-2014, 11:11 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-23-2014, 01:56 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-23-2014, 04:45 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 01-27-2014, 02:45 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-27-2014, 03:06 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-28-2014, 05:22 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Renatus - 01-28-2014, 06:04 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 01-28-2014, 06:06 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-01-2014, 05:13 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-06-2014, 06:44 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Tim - 02-06-2014, 08:41 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-06-2014, 11:43 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 02-07-2014, 01:17 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-07-2014, 01:31 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-13-2014, 12:06 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Nathan Ross - 02-13-2014, 12:23 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-13-2014, 12:26 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-04-2014, 05:24 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 05-05-2014, 02:06 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-05-2014, 02:17 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Robert Vermaat - 05-06-2014, 09:46 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-27-2014, 12:04 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-20-2015, 04:38 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin I - 06-20-2015, 06:28 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-20-2015, 07:42 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin I - 06-24-2015, 04:49 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-24-2015, 06:32 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Robert Vermaat - 06-25-2015, 07:35 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-25-2015, 11:34 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-22-2015, 09:55 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 08-23-2015, 06:54 PM
The Journal of Late Antiquity - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-23-2015, 08:05 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 08-26-2015, 06:27 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 08-26-2015, 11:35 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 08-27-2015, 01:18 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Luka Borščak - 09-02-2015, 05:44 PM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 09-03-2015, 02:25 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Luka Borščak - 09-03-2015, 08:34 AM
The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 09-03-2015, 11:18 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 02-29-2016, 02:51 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-15-2016, 05:12 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 05-25-2016, 07:08 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin I - 05-26-2016, 11:52 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-26-2016, 01:53 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 05-26-2016, 05:28 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Michael Kerr - 05-26-2016, 02:20 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-27-2016, 02:04 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin I - 05-28-2016, 04:23 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-28-2016, 02:40 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 05-30-2016, 04:11 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Robert Vermaat - 05-31-2016, 10:34 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-30-2016, 05:38 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Robert Vermaat - 05-31-2016, 11:52 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 05-31-2016, 12:14 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 06-01-2016, 12:19 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-01-2016, 01:34 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Robert Vermaat - 06-01-2016, 11:45 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 06-01-2016, 01:45 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-01-2016, 06:59 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 06-01-2016, 07:52 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-01-2016, 09:33 PM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Justin Swanton - 06-02-2016, 05:41 AM
RE: The Whole North Into Gaul - by Flavivs Aetivs - 06-02-2016, 03:00 PM

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