Petrol price action

[Tarbicus]

The oil companies are crooks and are ripping us off. Blunt enough?

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

The media muzzled by the govt and their investors.......blunt enough?

Jim, all business are out to make money? You must under stand tha tconcept, but look at the facts......TAX. Blunt enough?

[Na Saighdiuir]

Hmm the timing of this piece is quite amazing.Today the Minister for resources in the irish parliament came under fire about fuel prices.He stated that the price of fuel will not fall anytime soon.Quite worrying as petrol is about 1.35 and diesel,1.40!!!.Get your bikes ready!

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

Yep, taxed to death too?

I paid anything from £1.17 to £1.27 for the same fuel in various stations up the country recently.....

[Primvs Pavlvs]

The oil companies are crooks and are ripping us off. Blunt enough?

Should they give it away? Is there crime in making profit? Its easy to avoid, don't buy it!

[M. Demetrius]

It's always easiest to jump on the intangible "they", whether Big Business, Big Government, Big Whatever. Most of us would agree that fuels are overtaxed, because the governments everywhere see a clear way for renewable income. Here in Texas, the legislature decided to bring up a fuel tax increase (ready for their reason?) because they haven't increased those taxes in six years. hock: Now that's a good reason.

But before we get too angry here, I'd like to propose a lull in the postings, so people can calm down. There are as many articles on the one side mentioned as the other, it seems, as I've spent the last couple of hours looking things over. Would that be too much? It's an interesting topic, if we can keep from poking fingers in each others' eyes, you know?

Here's something to google and marvel about. Sovereign Wealth Funds and Bank of International Settlements. Interesting reading. The interconnectedness is quite amazing, and seems unlikely to be coincidental.

Peace flag for now?

[Komet]

The really big reason that the prices are going up is that the supply has been held pretty constant for the last 20 years or so, but the demand has tripled, and now with China and India coming on board as motor-driven economies, it will only increase the demand.

There is more oil than is being brought up. It's laws that keep it in the ground, not the businessmen.

We need to be careful here, though, brothers, because we could easily and quickly stray into modern politics, etc. and get ourselves in trouble.

This is true. There is a lot of oil off of the coast of Florida and in Alaska, but environmentalists in America have stifled energy production have close to three years--not just with oil, but also nuclear energy. The governor of Alaska is practically begging businesses to dig new wells in the northern corner of ANWR (the area was actually specifically set aside for oil exploration). I read there is as much oil in reserve under ANWR as Venezuela or Saudi Arabia. The politics of doing something potentially damaging to the environment always outweighs failing to act and damaging the economy in America. America has the ability to ween itself from its dependence on other nations for oil, but I don't think Europe is. Sucks for you guys.

[Tarbicus]

Its currently around 4.00 USD per gallon in my neck o' the woods. Sure, it hurts to fill up the tank, but its not hurting myself, or my family to the point we are making drastric changes.

Paul, you know Byron's price quotes were per litre? The lower price is therefore [size=150:c3577mlz]$8.24 a gallon [/size]!!!! Without the UK duty that's $4.12 per gallon, so to get a realistically comparable price that it would cost you in the US, add your tax percentage on gas to that figure (roughly one third on average I believe, which would make it $5.49 a gallon).

So, to answer the questions about "business making profit" and the like - I don't care, they're rigging the prices, and they can kiss my big fat hairy scouse arse.

[DECIMvS MERCATIvS VARIANvS]

Jim's right. Oil companies ARE ripping everyone off. I drive a truck and I can tell you that it's hurting people and even BIG companies like Jevic are going out of business. :evil: It's all BS and this is something cooked up by scumbags manipulating the markets. We need to be drilling in ANWR and the new Dakota's finds.

This was in the Sacramento Bee
Gov't discloses investigation of crude-oil market
The Associated Press
Last Updated 11:01 am PDT Thursday, May 29, 2008

WASHINGTON -- Federal regulators are six months into a wide-ranging investigation of U.S. oil markets, with a focus on possible price manipulation.

The Commodity Futures Trading Commission says it started the probe in December and is taking the unusual step of publicizing it "because of today's unprecedented market conditions."

Crude prices have risen more than 42 percent since early December, when they hovered below $90 a barrel. Gasoline prices are nearing a national average of $4 a gallon, up from about $3.20 a year ago.

The agency said details of the investigation remain confidential.

[Magnus]

Just saw a guy in Buffalo, New York USA who came up with an alternative to an oxcy-accetalene <sp> torch that actually runs off of water. Burns hotter than the surface of the sun, but you can touch the end of the nozzle with your fingers and not get burned.

The guy also modified his car to run on the same system...uses electrolosis to seperate the hydrogen I think. But the by-product is water...

I think regardless of WHO is making the profits, we need to get away from fossil fuels. We can't handle the environmental impact nor the financial. Everyone loses in the end when you think about it.

It's also $1.20 and higher here per liter in Canada..last year it was around $0.90 - $1.00.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

I'll agree about the scumbags who manipulate the markets, but the oil companies are not the ones who do that. the Investors, ie the financial institution who deal in money and speculators....

true some will be from the oils industry but most will have never seen anythin of an oil installation except in a picture.....

And Jim, sorry but the figures I gave, you are seeing the figure of (with the rough conversion rate $2 /£1)

for a $11.86 gallon the non-tax portion is
$2.86....... which is divided by transportation costs, the share that goes to the owner/licence holder at the gas station etc....

you have confused the 50% UKduty on a barrel of oil, that is what the gov gets even before it gets it tax on petrol....

So yes the price of gas at the pumps is too high......but put the blame where it deserves .......

@Magnus, I've been a big fan of hydrogen conversion systems for years, glad to hear someone has developed one...

my idea was for a closed loop system to convert the water back to hydrogen/ oxygen.......burn the fuel....convert the waste back to oxy/hydrogen....etc ad infinitum.

Jim I admire your sentiments for wanting to do something but try to look at the whole picture here......

[Libitina]

Whether it's the oil companies or the governments ripping us off it's all starting to affect my family

We've been getting by the last two weeks with only £6 + petrol money because our gas and electric bill came through.

It's easy to say get on a bike but there's four of us, two are under 7 and we live surrounded by winding country roads that lorries and cars bomb down at 60mph. I don't have a deathwish!

Oddly enough I had a saleman knock at the door yesterday for a company that delivers food to your door. I checked the prices and was £40 for 6 chicken kievs :lol: I had in inform him now is not really the time for people to be buying that kinda stuff!

There was a thread elsewhere on how rising fuel might affect reenactment events. I doubt it would cause a big difference but I know we had to spend quite a lot getting to one event earlier this month.

Anyhoo, off to flog more possessions on Ebay!

[Tarbicus]

for a $11.86 gallon the non-tax portion is
$2.86....... which is divided by transportation costs, the share that goes to the owner/licence holder at the gas station etc....

you have confused the 50% UKduty on a barrel of oil, that is what the gov gets even before it gets it tax on petrol....

If the oil companies are being hit so hard then how come ExxonMobil are sitting on over $25 billion in the bank with virtually no debt left, the oil companies are actually in a position where they are buying back the public shares held by those outside of their companies, yet the basic price barrel has tripled since 2002? If they increase the price per barrel, that naturally increases the tax and duty on the barrel. Their profits are so obscene that they're now getting slammed with windfall tax. The notion that speculators are driving up the price is a red herring and probably accounts for a minor effect as no matter what the initial upfront payment is, it still has to be paid at the end of the day in full.

You can't get around the plain and simple fact that they have trebled the price of a barrel of oil since 2002 simply because they can. The more expensive the petrol is, the more tax is paid on it. If the price per barrel is less, we pay less tax at the pumps and the net cost to a consumer is less.

In the US the transportation, license and tax costs still exists.

Here's a breakdown if the price of a litre at the pumps was £1.15:
http://www.petrolprices.com/images/petr ... iagram.gif

Subsequent tax on petrol? The tax you pay is largely down to how good your accountants are, and where you put the money.

[Gaius Julius Caesar]

So you think those who actually produce something for society are the one who should be penalised........basically.

The speculators..ie those wit hthe fancy accountants etc speculators,
are the ones who have driven the bubble to bursting point...as your own link stated earlier.....

Where do you get your figure from on the breakdown what is the source?

You haven't responded to the red herring you put out earlier about the 50% duty which you apply to the cost of petrol..... ? That is the oil royalties....the petrol tax is the largest tax/cut from petrol, the issue here, and do you recall when the price of oil was $19 per barrel, the tax was 87% on petrol.....


Subsequent tax on petrol? The tax you pay is largely down to how good your accountants are, and where you put the money.

Are you referring to something else here Jim? What has that got to do with Tax on petrol? nothing.....

[Primvs Pavlvs]

Jim, the only thing else I am going to add to this debate. Yes, I am well aware of the conversion rate, and that the UK/ EU is paying more for petro than we are. However, if you take into consideration that we were paying around 2 USD per gallon in 2004 the same basic increase that is hitting you, is hitting us. Its approx. a 50% increase in the past 4 years.


I noticed that you mentioned that you have no vehicle. I am curious, why do you have a dog in this fight? I own both a truck, and a car. I average nearly 30 miles per day round trip for work alone. I should be the one making the louder argument, but I am not.