Egyptians in the New World?

[ruski94]

that is a bit too little time, they are first sailing down the coast of west Africa then they will be caught in the current as they reach the Gulf of Guinea and then that is when they will be headed towards South America. All together that could take at least 1-3 months

[Epictetus]

If they are drifting for months they might resort to cannibalism. That would solve your provisioning problem.

[ruski94]

it's only two months and according to the wikipedia article http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_exped...ran_Africa
they knew it would take around 40 days to travel from the Cape Verde Islands to the Gulf of Guinea so I think they would be well supplied. Plus they are going to stop at the Cape Verde Islands anyway to restock so I think they will have about enough supplies.

How does this sound for a fleet?
3 Quinquermes - 300 crew and 120 marines each
4 Liburnae - 300 crew and 120 marines each
5 merchant (cargo/transport) ships - 12 to 30 crewmen each and also 1/2 a cohort of legionaries spread across the ships

[Robert Vermaat]

Maybe so, but there's still about 1180 miles between the Atlas and the Senegal, and that's more or less in a straight line. Equivalent to marching from Constantinople to the Rhine - and then they'd have to do the same distance back again! Unless they had some pressing reason to do so, I doubt a Roman commander would take his men so very far.

Why a pressing reason? Trade routes and/or exploration would be reason enough, about the same as travelling up the Nile I presume.

Your point about the Carthaginians having elephants also suggests that elephants were found much further north - in southern Morocco perhaps? - and that Paulinus wouldn't have had to go quite so far to find them.

Does my point suggest that? I don't think so. I think that Carthage had trade routes to the south which provided them with elephants, although indeed I presume that they were found much further North than today. But in Marocco?

[M. Demetrius]

I would think that to be too many soldiers unless this was a battle-ready group. But it's your story, and your reasons will fill in blanks like that. A trireme could manage 150 marines, but they would generally not have been on board unless the navarchvs was expecting a military vessel attack. Pirates would not require your total of approx 1100 fighting men otherwise.

But again, that's just me.

[Nathan Ross]

Why a pressing reason? Trade routes and/or exploration would be reason enough, about the same as travelling up the Nile I presume.

Sure - but the other expeditions mentioned by Pliny were purely exploratory, and consisted of a few men. Paulinus was in Mauretania as a legion legate, charged with putting down a rebellion. He may have advanced south of the Atlas to pursue the rebels, or establish a southern border, but I wouldn't say that a legate in command of a legion would have marched more than a thousand miles into the wilderness just to explore trade routes...

Actually I don't think Pliny describes Suetonius advancing all that far at all - just 'some way' south of the Atlas. Here's the original latin (Natural History V 14-15). Perhaps someone could divine from it what sort of distance Pliny is talking about?:

Suetonius Paulinus, quem consulem vidimus, primus Romanorum ducum transgressus quoque Atlantem aliquot milium spatio, prodidit de excelsitate quidem eius quae ceteri, imas radices densis altisque repletas silvis incognito genere arborum, proceritatem spectabilem esse enodi nitore, frondes cupressi similes praeterquam gravitate odoris, tenui eas obduci lanugine, quibus addita arte posse quales e bombyce vestes confici. verticem altis etiam aestate operiri nivibus. decumis se eo pervenisse castris et ultra ad fluvium, qui Ger vocatur, per solitudines nigri pulveris, eminentibus interdum velut exustis cautibus, loca inhabitabilia fervore, quamquam hiberno tempore, experto. qui proximos inhabitent saltus, refertos elephantorum ferarumque et serpentium omni genere, Canarios appellari, quippe victum eius animalis promiscuum iis esse et dividua ferarum viscera. iunctam Aethiopum gentem, quos Perorsos vocant, satis constat.

Does my point suggest that? I don't think so. I think that Carthage had trade routes to the south which provided them with elephants, although indeed I presume that they were found much further North than today. But in Marocco?

Ah, sorry, I thought that was what you were suggesting there. But anyway - I would think that either a) Pliny was exaggerating about Suetonius finding wild elephants on his travels, or b) such elephants were indeed found in southern Morocco at the time. Either option would be preferable to taking Suetonius and his legion all the way south to Senegal!

[ruski94]

I would think that to be too many soldiers unless this was a battle-ready group. But it's your story, and your reasons will fill in blanks like that. A trireme could manage 150 marines, but they would generally not have been on board unless the navarchvs was expecting a military vessel attack. Pirates would not require your total of approx 1100 fighting men otherwise.

i dont think they'll be going into full out combat so i think i'll decrease the number. The most combat that they might get into is with some natives in what is modern day french guiana but otherwise i don't think Paulinus Mauratanius is expecting to be fighting anyone on his travels down the west coast of Africa.

[Alanus]

My one problem is that I'm not sure what kind of people would be on that fleet..Would any of you know?

People who like Barbados rum, most likely. :roll:

[A_Volpe]

Building that Time Machine...How is that coming along?

I've got places and times to go visit....

[Alanus]

Hello Andy,

I went back to the year 499 and wrote a novel about End-Time panic. Took place in the Old World, though. No time machine, but there is a flying yurt. :lol: