Hunnish-Magyar language lesson.

[Virilis]

This is interesting, hun words seem to be even closer to finnish language than magyar (according to this list, where the magyar word is first mentioned...).

hal - kala, - 'Fish.' ("kala" in finnish)
kõ - kevi, - Stone ("kivi" in finnish)
réz - vase, - metal ("vaski" in old finnish)
jég - jéj, - Ice. ("jää" in finnish)
falu - kügü, - village ("kylä" in finnish)
szó, beszéd - szava, - word ("sana" in finnish)
nyil - neil, - arrow ("nuoli" in finnsh)
tojás - moni, -egg ("muna" in finnsh)
étkezés - pala. - Food and drinks ("pala" in old finnish)

[Chariovalda]

Truly amazing, Jyrki. I am really starting to wonder if the words are derived from some Finnish language, rather than some unknown source of Hun words...

I smell fish oil... :wink:

[Treveri Gaul]

Hallo.

The Suomi people and the Hungarian people our languages are related, but we have nothing common in marker genes. Hungarian marker genes mediterran.

[Virilis]

I smell fish oil...

What? Where? I smell "snake oil :wink: "...

[Chariovalda]

Okaaaaaay...

I think I tracked the source down. B. Lukacs, a Hungarian...well, I am not sure what he is, he claims the impressive-sounding title of "President of the Matter Evolution Subcommittee of the Geonomy Scientific Committee of HAS", whatever THAT means (though HAS stands for the Hungarian Academy of Sciences) He does have a penchant for pontificating on Hungarian linguistic history, religion and a lot of other things. An eccentric physicist? I really have no idea.

Anyway, Lukacs refers here [url:2seuw6qx]http://www.rmki.kfki.hu/~lukacs/DETREHUN.htm[/url] to a "Hunnic" dictionary, published in 2003 (though dated 2004...stranger), which was in an earlier form also published on the site of Heribert Illig. For those who don't know him (I didn't until now), he is a German former bank employee who claims that ancient Egyptian history is 2,000 years shorter, that the Pyramid of Cheops was therefore built in the first millennium BC and, oh yeah, that the years between 614 and 911 never happened. That's right, Charlemagne, Bede, the Byzantine Empress Irene and the rise of Islam never happened. Poitiers? Nah! Anyway, Illig's site can be found here, for those who wish to broaden their horizons:[url:2seuw6qx]http://www.mantis-verlag.de[/url].

Now on with the matter of the Huns. According to Lukacs, the authors of the dictionary are a geologist, Csaba Detre, and a physicist, a certain Bérczi. Although Lukacs had tried but failed to contact them, "...one author...is a physicist at a university, the other is a geologist, so both work in Science Proper. So I am not permitted to question their scientific honour and have to regard the published material genuine."

Well, erm... :? Ladies and gentlemen, that is ONE HELL of a scientifically sound argument in favour of the claims made by Mssrs Bérczi and Detre.

After mentioning that the Zhuan-zhuan and the Avars were the same, and that the Avars occupied the Carpathian basin on Easter monday, 568 AD (I wonder if they did so in the morning or the afternoon?), Lukacs arrives, after some other stuff, at the story of the discovery of the Hunnic dictionary. Apparently, Detre went to Armenia in the 1960s, found bilingual Hunnic-Armenian texts in some monastery, and this was the basis of the dictionary. Oh, and the Hunnic manuscripts are now in an abbey in Isfahan in Iran. Presumably, nobody has seen them, or made photographs, or whatever.

I do wonder why Detre et al published their findings only in 2003 (and why was the book dated 2004? No matter), when the initial discovery took place in the 1960s. Perhaps it wasn't safe under communist rule, but the Iron Curtain fell long before 2003/4.

Now, Lukacs claims that the Hunnic texts derived from fragments of the Hun confederacy who ended up near the Caucasus, and were converted by the Armenians. By and in itself I don't think this all that implausible; more fragments of peoples ended up near or in the Caucasus; even today there's a people called the Avars in the Russian Caucasus region of Dagestan, although they speak a Caucasian, not a Turkic (or, for that matter, Finno-Ugric 8) ) language and their connection with the earlier Avars is uncertain.

What is troubling, though, is that the whole edifice rests on a single pair of authors, who made their claims in an obscure publication, based on a discovery in Armenian manuscripts in the 1960s, published over 40 years later. As for the original manuscripts, there are no pictures and they rest now in some obscure abbey in the heart of Iran. Which means that they can not be studied or tested (well, presumably they can, but it's far enough away that not many people will dash over there and verify...).

As for the words, what is interesting is that singa, lion, is known as a Sanskrit word (compare with Singapore, the city of the lion, or the -singh surname of the Sikhs), while sira, tiger, looks related to Hindi sher, which also means tiger (remember Shere Khan in Jungle Book?). Hovi seems reminiscent of Proto-Indo-European owis, while racsa sounds much like the word for rat, which was known as "ratta" in Old Saxon and "ræt" in Anglo-Saxon. Racsa could be coincidence (this happens, compare for instance "gaijin" and "goyim"), but I smell a rat, as in a word that should be a loanword, presumably from vulgar Latin rattus, but occurs in a language that's a long way from the nearest Romance language.

Anybody interested in going to Isfahan, bother its Armenian monks (if any are left) and prove the Hunnic dictionary genuine? Remember, this is your opportunity for scientific immortality! :twisted:

[Virilis]

Andreas, you are the real MYTHBUSTER hock: ! Next you will tell us that the bosnian pyramids are not real :wink: ...

[Iosephus]

Damn,
I was away for a while and the Big Hungarian World Dominance Conspiracy was overthrown by some enthusiastic RAT-ers!

So now finally you all know that your country's culture, language, alphabet, music etc. etc. are all the creations of the Ancient, or so called, Proto-Hungarians!

So, just some facts about the origins of the Hungarians:
- the sumerians were Hungarians
- the parthians were Hungarians
- the schythians were Hungarians
- the huns were Hungarians
- the Japanese were Hungarians
- the Avars were Hungarians
- the first neoilithic inhabitants of Europe originated from the Carpathian basin and (you won't find out) they were Hungarians as well (or at least spoke Hungarian - maybe they were only the slaves of the Hungarian Masters of the Earth)
- turanian people were also Hungarians
BUT
- finno-ugric volks are definetly NOT Hungarians

Some things the Hungarians invented:
- wheel
- alphabet
- pottery
- horseback riding
- writing rhymes and verses
- bronze working
- metallurgy
- archery (especially the mounted version)
- theater
etc. etc.

and by the way acording to the latest findings Stonehenge was build by the Hungarians as well.

***** SIGH *****

Your really don't know how much pain I suffer from these self-proclaimed-pseudo-historian-idiotic-hardcore-Hungarians who seem to have a limitless supply of reinforcements since the fall of the communist regime in Hungary!

And now here comes a statement of mine (because I'm really really upset now):

This topic has nothing to do with Hungarian history and is not supported by any official Hungarian Institute of Science or any members of it. What is written here is pure fantasy and speculation!

Therefore I strongly recommend this topic to be moved to the off-topic section where it belongs!
IMHO

Thanks!

Ps:
Chariovalda, laudes awarded

[Iosephus]

Huh, I feel much better now! 8)

[Martin Wallgren]

I agree with mr. Janák! Move it to Off topic!

[Robert Vermaat]

a German former bank employee who claims that ancient Egyptian history is 2,000 years shorter, that the Pyramid of Cheops was therefore built in the first millennium BC and, oh yeah, that the years between 614 and 911 never happened. That's right, Charlemagne, Bede, the Byzantine Empress Irene and the rise of Islam never happened. Poitiers? Nah!

Ah, that sounds a LOT like Immanuel Velikovsy's theories...

[Robert Vermaat]

So, just some facts about the origins of the Hungarians:
- the sumerians were Hungarians
- the parthians were Hungarians
- the schythians were Hungarians
- the huns were Hungarians
- the Japanese were Hungarians
- the Avars were Hungarians
- the first neoilithic inhabitants of Europe originated from the Carpathian basin and (you won't find out) they were Hungarians as well (or at least spoke Hungarian - maybe they were only the slaves of the Hungarian Masters of the Earth)
- turanian people were also Hungarians
BUT
- finno-ugric volks are definetly NOT Hungarians

Ah, but you forget that Etruscan is the same writing as Hunnic and therefore Hungarian, and that Hungarians are Mediterranean people - so the Roman empire was also Hungarian! :wink:

This topic has nothing to do with Hungarian history and is not supported by any official Hungarian Institute of Science or any members of it. What is written here is pure fantasy and speculation!

Therefore I strongly recommend this topic to be moved to the off-topic section where it belongs!

Thy wish is my command. [/quote]

[Chariovalda]

Aw, drat, and I was on a roll...

Oh, as an encore: the Mayas are Magyars too! I actually stumbled on a piece by another Hungarian amateur linguist proving Sumerian, and hence Magyar, influence in the Maya language.

In fact, combine this with the "spacy" connection made by a guy named Moricz and I think we might quote Battlestar Galactica:

"“There are those who believe that life here began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans who may have been the forefathers of the Egyptians, or the Toltecs, or the Mayans, or the Magyars. They may have been the architects of the great pyramids, or the lost civilizations of Lemuria or Atlantis. Some believe that there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive somewhere beyond the heavens…â€

[Treveri Gaul]

Hello.

Zsa Zsa Gabor he is forever young :lol:

Robert.

I don't understand your outbursts. You don't know us.

[Chariovalda]

Hello.

Zsa Zsa Gabor he is forever young :lol:

Is (s)he? I am not so sure...

The not-so-youngish Zsa-zsa, police mug shot:


By the way, concerning pyramids and Magyars, here's the Zsa Zsa Gabor Memorial boulder:


Notice the shape? Coincidence? I think not!
And to prove the link with Aliens, there's this picture:



This alien creature is called "Zsa-Zsa Gabor Fantasy Island". Friends, Romans, countrymen, do we need any more evidence of the true nature of ancient astronauts and the pyramids?

[size=75:2v93n72e]You know what? I think this thread has now gone officially batshit loco. I have been laughing so hysterically I am getting a headache the size of Mount Vesuvius [/size]

[Treveri Gaul]

I'm so sorry that this topic to be OFF. It's my fault? Maybe.
'Perhaps one day in the European history, all pieces go in the they
place. That sure.

Chariovalda. Apropo Zsa Zsa Gabor. The American english language have a word: Itsy-bitsy. Little at little. This is Hungarian text ici-pici. Hungarian emigrant / Zsa Zsa Gabor, George Cukor/ talking in Hollywood.