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The Makedonian phalanx -- why such depth?
#98
Paul B. wrote:
Quote:I'd like to see a thousand yard line of your recruits at 6' spacing move over complex terrain into the teeth of the enemy- all the while veering signifcantly to the right. Bunching is a perennial problem with men under fire or entering danger.
...again, I don't think you've properly envisaged what Xenophon/I have described. The normal/open order is used for marching and, once the Phalanx is deployed into line, the 'approach march' ( see e.g. the description of Issus earlier by Callisthenes), out of range of the enemy and usually screened by light infantry/psiloi. Once the lights are recalled, or fall back through the Phalanx, the order is given to 'close up'.The 'advance to contact'/charge is then carried out in close order into "the teeth of the enemy" at a distance of roughly 1-200 yards ( across the effective missile zone).Any veering to the right occurs at this time, as men edge closer to their companions shields, and the Commander, generally on the right flank, endeavours to avoid outflanking and edges right....
Bunching is unlikely, partly because of the size of the shields, held flat across the body for maximum protection, which also serve as natural 'spacers', and because the 'bunching under fire' you refer to is a modern phenomenon, of troops spread widely seeking moral support from their fellow-soldiers - Greek hoplites are already as close as they can be.

Quote:You have asserted that men cannot advance at a more natural spacing, just over a body-width- and I don't buy it. There are many examples of troops advancing as I suggest:
I haven't asserted that at all!
But an advance over a long distance, when trees, rocks ponds and other obstacles must be circumnavigated, is far easier in an open order than close.

Also, there is no "6ft spacing" The Hoplite with shield protruding to his right occupies 3 feet of the 6, leaving just enough room for another to 'close up' ( i.e. 3 feet gap between soldiers in 'open order' )
I'm afraid I don't find the clips relevant at all.....I thought your argument was that amateur militia hoplites couldn't/didn't perform rigid automaton 18 C. style drill ? The 'vikings' are a joke.....

And in any event, as I've just explained, and earlier ( see e.g. description of Persian advance at Cunaxa) that the final advance to contact is performed in close order - whether we are talking Barbarians, Greeks, Macedonians, Romans....whatever!!
"dulce et decorum est pro patria mori " - Horace
(It is a sweet and proper thing to die for ones country)

"No son-of-a-bitch ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country" - George C Scott as General George S. Patton
Paul McDonnell-Staff
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Messages In This Thread
Re: The Makedonian phalanx -- why such depth? - by Paullus Scipio - 04-10-2009, 06:08 AM

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